This Sunday I was on an 100% full flight out of MIA with 20+ people on standby, where a woman rushed from her seat just before they closed the door and exited the plane because she felt swashed sitting in the middle row next to a larger person.

I've wondered what they did for that person as all the flights that day were overbooked or had huge standby lists. In my mind if the lack of space was so serious that she got off the plane, then AA should be expected to accommodate her. Since she left the plane so late no one was placed in her seat.

From the obese passenger's standpoint I feel it is fair that they are charged differently. Think of cars, we don't expect that an obese should be able to by a larger car at the same price as a smaller car if they can not fit into the smaller car. Instead we just expect that they just buy a car which fits their body. The airlines do the same, they offer two sizes of seats economy and first class, with the option to purchase two economy seats if desired.

Posted By Iolaire McFadden on January 31, 2008, 12:52 PM

Speaking from both sides of the fat - at one time I was 291 lbs and always opted for the window seat because I always felt comfortably out of the way - I never used the restroom onboard flights and always stayed in my seat. Once I even had to ask for a seatbealt extension. Did I feel bad? No, It was who I was at that time in my life. Now I am 164 lbs and still opt for the window seat and still don't used the onboard flight restrooms. I still stay in my seat and respect others around me...did losing all that weight change me? NO, it changed everyone else. I don't agree with charging obese people extra, just because they are obese doesn't mean their wallets are fat.

Posted By Pamela Brown-Scott on January 31, 2008, 1:39 PM

Well, being an obese person, I know that whenever I get on an airplane I pray that I get one seat with a vacant one next to it. I am just as uncomfortable as is any person who has to share a seat next to me. I would be more than happy to spend a little extra to have some extra room, without flying first class. Most of us cannot afford first class seats, but would happily pay more for coach seats with more room. Perhaps the airlines should have a few seats on every plane that are somewhat larger, that a larger person could purchase, just to have more room.

One time I did buy two seats, only to have the person I was sharing the three seat row with, commandeer the center seat for himself. When I told him I had purchased that seat for myself, he ignored me and put his feet up on the center seat. When I complained to the flight attendant, she just shrugged her shoulders and said she was sorry. I will never purchase two seats again.

Posted By Nancy Brown on January 31, 2008, 1:56 PM

I think the airlines should build a few bigger seats for the overweight, only right that they have some room on a airline. Most all seating arrangement now days are to small.

Ever try going to an older sports stadium where they measured the people at 5' 6" and 140 pounds, try fitting in those little seats for 4 hours.

Most Obese people don't realize it or just hate to do it but they can get a disabled permit from their doctor, maybe they should!!

Posted By Art Vangriff on February 2, 2008, 6:42 PM

I know the subject is obesity but this dialogue can apply to tall people also. I am 6'7" and most airplanes do not accomadate tall people. Obese people can change their situation through dieting and exercise. Tall people have no choice but to fill like a quart of milk in a pint container.

Posted By Chris Brown on February 3, 2008, 4:15 PM

From experience, there is no easy solution to this problem.

My father is an overweight individual and has in the past bought two seats. But every time he has done it, the seat gets taken up somehow.

Once it was by a standby passenger, a pilot who had to get to the next airport and it was a necessity. We were not even refunded the money.

Another time it was a woman carrying a baby, who just wanted to put the baby down for a second, which turned into the whole flight.

Now if I do fly with my father, we do not purchase 2 seats cause we have been burned in the past by it.

Posted By cindy on February 4, 2008, 12:10 PM

The fault lies first with the obese passenger, but let's not forget that the airlines have shrunken our seats and legroom considerably through the decades. I remember in the fifties our seats were so large that I could fold my legs next to me, in the seat, and sleap in a modified fetal position. Really!

Posted By Molly Shannon on February 4, 2008, 12:11 PM

I beleive that obese passengers should pay for the extra ticket. Why should the airline or other passengers have to pay for it? It's that persons fault that they are obese, no one elses so it should be their responsibility. I don't see it as a disability, it's simple, unless you really have some disease that causes you to be that overweight, it's your fault that you are that way, go on a diet and exercise and lose the weight, that's what everyone else does, don't push it on the rest of the world to accomodate your lifestyle.

Posted By kathleen on February 4, 2008, 12:11 PM

I don't think it's fair for a 300lbs person to take up half of the seat that you paid for. I was stuck next to someone of considerable size once and he asked me if i could put the armrest up. I refused and he got all huffy and puffy, like it's my fault he's obese.

I take a lot of pride in maintaining my health, not eating corn syrup or eating at burger king. Why do i have to be penalized for someone else's inability to maintain a healthy lifestyle.

If you want to take up half my seat, maybe you should purchase it before. Or maybe better yet be prepared to pay me off directly at my seat for half of my fair that you are taking up.

Posted By Tom jackson on February 4, 2008, 12:14 PM

First, let's remember that if being thin were easy, everyone would be thin.

I'm heavier, but certainly not large enough to inconvenience neighbors, but my husband is a large man who is also pretty round. I HATE flying with him because he ends up leaning on me rather than taking up room of the person on the other side of him. So, I definitely can relate to the problem.

Ultimately the problem is with the design of the airplanes. What does it say that the planes are not accommodating a very high percentage of the population? In the future, this should be addressed.

In the present, I think it has to be dealt with on a case by case basis.

Posted By Meghan on February 4, 2008, 12:15 PM

People that aren't obese have just as much right to every inch of space that their seat allows too - just because a larger person is sitting next to them doesn't mean they should have to sacrifice any of their space. I am not obese, but I'm a tall person who needs to spread out in the given seat room in order to have even the slightest bit of comfort. As Chris said - obese people can lose weight, but tall people can't shrink.

Posted By Jenny H on February 4, 2008, 12:17 PM

HI. I had live that nightmare. The airlines made the parents paid for their kids it should be the same for overweight people. They should paid extra and the airline should have a special road on the back for them . They'll be more comfortable and we all be happy.

Posted By Lissette Villanueva on February 4, 2008, 12:19 PM

I being on the heavier side of things always try to travel with a skinny friend who understands my situation. Also I have asked to change places before. Don't be afraid to speak up.

Posted By SaraLee on February 4, 2008, 12:21 PM

If the airline charges so much extra for overweight luggage, why shouldn't there be an extra charge for excessive body weight? I greatly resent it when someone next to me oozes over 1/4 of my seat. The best solution would be for the airlines to provide wider seats for obese people with a 50% surcharge. A person has the right to eat as much as he wishes as long as the consequence is not at my expense.

Posted By John on February 4, 2008, 12:21 PM

Perhaps if the airlines made seating as in your car, home, school or any other seat, more obese people and every one on the planes would be comfortable. There should be weight limits for pasengers fares however.
If a carmaker made seats in cars sized as airline seats, no one would buy them, obese or not.

Posted By Dennis Buckelew on February 4, 2008, 12:21 PM

They should definitely have to buy enough space to accommodate their size. I've sat through so many flights of a sweaty overweight person basically on my lap. It's completely unfair to those of us who are fit.

Posted By jen on February 4, 2008, 12:22 PM

Creating larger seats for obese patrons sound reasonable, but at what cost? At 160 lbs, I'm not obese, but if I had a choice to be very comfortable in a larger seat I would pay a little more for that comfort. I have an aunt who is obese and I know the pressures that come with being overweight. While dining out at Taco Bell, my aunt got stuck in the booth/table. We almost had to call the EMS squad to get her out, but she painfully wiggled out of the seat. If the restaurant had larger seats, we would have sat in them and saved her the embarrasment of getting stuck.

Posted By Eva on February 4, 2008, 12:22 PM

I also read the original letter, and my thought was that I would have insisted that the arm rest be put down. I was in this position once, and insisted that the large individual in the middle pick herself up, put down the arm rests, and did not spill over onto my seat. I think insisting that those arm rests keep the seats separate is the beginning. If the person does not fit in the defined space, the airline has a problem they need to address. I refuse to share my seat.

Posted By Shannon Sullivan on February 4, 2008, 12:23 PM

I for one will not sit in a seat on a plane with an overweight person taking up my seat - if they don't fit into the seat they need to buy 2 or 3 tickets, thus seats periods. i am so sick all all the fat ones - it is not an epedemy or illness -it's only because they want to eat non-stop. now we have to pay for extra luggage, tickets are more due to a plane needing more gasoline due to the heavy weight - it is idiotic to make excuses for them. they are eating up our health care system and everything - charge them by the pound...........

Posted By andrea wanders on February 4, 2008, 12:24 PM

In every industry that deals with people... Not cars, not animals.. but PEOPLE, there is the matter of customer service. Industries are judged by the level of customer service they impart and making a Person feel comfortable on a flight is important to the N-th degree. There should be seats available on every flight for overweight, tall, and handicapped as well as mothers traveling with small children. The answer? I'm not in the industry of building airplains for passenger flights. But it seems to me that some engineer somewhere should re address this issue. I know with the price of fuels rising all the time, having as many $$people$$ on a flight as possible is important, but if they complain and want their money back have you really done your best at custoemr service. I think the first Flight Service to offer Personalize seating, at a price of course, will quickly monopolize the industry until the others catch on! I dare you... :)

Posted By Ann Thibodeaux on February 4, 2008, 12:25 PM

I have written about the recent Canadian decision in my online column about accessible recreation at Suite101.com.

Based upon the decision, it is possible, though I would not say a sure thing, that the extra tall might also qualify for seating accommodation - but I don't think the airlines are going to offer that voluntarily without an order compelling them to do so.

I also think there is a brilliant marketing opportunity here and I hope the airlines get ahead of it. The ruling on "one passenger, one fare" requires the affected airlines to allow a disabled person to bring an attendant at no charge if the attendant is required on the flight, and requires them to provide reasonable accommodation for people who are disabled by obesity - probably with a larger seat or an empty seat beside them.

I think that if the airlines offered a deeply discounted fare to these travellers on off-peak times, everyone would win. It's true that not everyone can be flexible about when they have to fly, but if a passenger has flexibility and there is a price inducement, perhaps they would choose the off-peak flight. The airline would then be able to sell its higher priced seats on a one person, one seat basis.

Posted By Jill Browne on February 4, 2008, 12:25 PM

maybe we should start giving height and weight info when we book a seat and the airlines could plan accordingly - ever taken a puddle jumper across the caribbean - they weight you and your luggage???

Posted By tina mitchell on February 4, 2008, 12:26 PM

Next they'll be charging for armrests! How many people (skinny and not) have had to sit in the dreaded middle seat with either their elbows and arms safely stowed close to their sides w/ hands in their laps, or "hugging" themselves for a flight lasting an hour or two? I feel like I need therapy after those flights. Maybe they could just make those seats for folks who weigh less than 150lbs and charge less, and the larger passengers could have the aisle and window seats and pay more.

Posted By Rod Marshall on February 4, 2008, 12:26 PM

I believe that the responsibility is on the airlines. They are the ones that try to put so many seats inside an airplane and they do this by making the seats so narrow, that is can be quite uncomfortable for an even moderately over weight person. To be completely comfortable one would have to be a child or an anorexic person, which children probably are not flying by them selves that often and the seats should not be made to their body size and no one should be so skinny because they are anorexic. In closing I feel that the airlines could make the seats at least a little bit wider. As far as one person paying more is ludicrous, they are going to the same destination, unless of course they are sitting in the first class section.

Posted By Linda Rodenberg on February 4, 2008, 12:27 PM

I believe that United Airlines has something called Economy Plus, which provides a bit more legroom for a few dollars more than an regular economy seat. Maybe UAL, and other airlines,should expand on this in providing larger size seats for obese people, and charge a slight premium for these seats. Everyone would be happy then.

Posted By E. McCaskill on February 4, 2008, 12:27 PM

The airlines profit from whittling away the seat-inches so that even average-size people are uncomfortable, so they should take the financial responsibility for creating situations like this.

Once on an overnight flight from US to Europe, I was entirely unable to sleep due to an enormous person who couldn't help but share my coach seat. Although I'd gone to a lot of trouble to shift my body's clock so that I'd be able to hit the ground running, I was so groggy that first day that I could hardly stay awake enough to make train connections.

It wasn't the fault of either passenger that I was sleep deprived, it was entirely the fault of the airlines for packing us in like sardines--especially when some of us are more the size of salmon.

Posted By Glenda on February 4, 2008, 12:28 PM

Oh, so your either obese ,tall, or both. Special seats, wider & roomier than the others would be more compatible & comfy.Price wise- higher fare for the accomodations. Would one be willing to pay for the comfort and signaled out as being needy & different? I think so. That's why people fly first class, for comfort.

Posted By Henrietta Olstynski on February 4, 2008, 12:31 PM

I think the airlines should have some larger seats in coach. They can charge a premium for them, but not the ridiculous amounts they charge for business and first class. Non weight challenged passengers can reserve them and pay the premium.

Posted By Joan Carroll on February 4, 2008, 12:32 PM

I am obese. I weigh about 370 pounds. This causes several issues.

The airlines already charge extra for overweight baggage. This is at least mostly for a different reason, that they discourage extra heavy baggage to save the backs of the baggage handlers. However, each pound of cargo or passenger requires fuel, and an obese person requires more fuel than an anorexic. I don't know if it is significant, but if it is significant then I could understand an extra charge for an obese person to cover the difference. I wouldn't like it, but I would understand.

The second issue is the comfort of fellow passengers. It is difficult enough to be comfortable while flying. An obese or wide-shouldered person next to you just make it worse, and I am both wide-shouldered and obese. I do what I can to minimize their discomfort, and I usually end up with my arms crossing my chest with my shoulders forward. I guess it helps that, although I fill the seat, I don't overflow into the next seat. But I notice that many obese people don't really care about the discomfort of others. They take up as much space as they can and they don't seem to care about others.

Posted By Duane on February 4, 2008, 12:32 PM

I'm a fat person, but not so fat that my body invades the space of the airline passenger who is seated next to me. If someone is so obese that their body expands into another passenger's space, the airline should require the obese person to purchase another seat or to purchase a seat in a cabin that has larger seats. Perhaps if most airlines provided wider seats and more leg rooms in coach/economy class, less people would need to spend the extra money to accommodate their extra weight.

Posted By Chubby person on February 4, 2008, 12:33 PM

I don't think coddling the obese is beneficial to anyone. While I agree it is a disability, it's a disability like alcoholism is a disability, where an emotional/physical need overwhelms well-being at every turn. It's not like cerebral palsy or autism. The obese pay more for clothing that requires more material, and for any other need that's to accomodate their extra size. I don't think flying should be any different, and I definitely don't think the airline should create larger seats to make it easier for people to be fat. Even having this conversation is indicative of the myriad ways America makes being physically unhealthy a viable option.

And for the record, I grew up with a morbidly obese mother.

Posted By Sarah Moeding on February 4, 2008, 12:34 PM

GET REAL! No one should have to give up their space for another person who cant put the fork down! It is each persons responsibility to fit in their seat... its not like all of a sudden the seats shrunk, or the airline has plotted to only have slim people as guests to prejudice the larger set. Its a matter of courtesy. I am 240lbs and would never travel via air and inconvenience someone else because of my choices to be lazy, shove my face full of bad foods, and then complain about not fitting in a plane seat. PAY THE EXTRA FEE and next time you might spend that money on a diet program.

Posted By Luke Powell on February 4, 2008, 12:34 PM

I believe that Southwest's "Passenger of Size" policy as written is the best possible solution for this problem. An oversize passenger (who does not fit entirely within their own seat) is obligated to buy a second seat. If that flight is not full, they get a refund. Unfortunately, it is not always enforced, because I had a (thankfully short) flight experience just like in the article, which made me research the policy in the first place. The passenger next to me (who was well into my seat, and using a seatbelt extender, on a full flight) must not have bought that extra seat. I just wish I had known to express my discomfort to the flight attendant. I know I was intentionally chosen as a row-mate because I am small (she basically said so) and I resent it. At least most of my flights are more comfortable!

Posted By Denise W on February 4, 2008, 12:35 PM

If a passenger has a portion of their seat taken by an obese passenger and they have to lean sideways or contort themselves in some other way, they are in increased danger of DVT or other injury from that unnatural position.

Posted By Dave on February 4, 2008, 12:38 PM

I think it's reasonable for airlines to have a weight/height guide on their website, and with travel agents that shows weight limits based on height, and by sex. Anything over the guide, the passenger should pay extra, and perhaps even a section of seats to accomodate these passengers. They will pay a premium for theses seats.

Posted By Jerry S on February 4, 2008, 12:38 PM

This is an issue of personal responsibility, not political correctness, which is a joke. Not only is it an inconvenience to the personally responsible, that control their weight and conform to the rules meant for the vast majority, society has to pay cost of someone's excesses through higher insurance, creating a situations that causes disruption & nconvenience. Let them pay a 50% surcharge. There is nothing worst than sitting next to sweaty smelly fat person on flight no matter how long or short.

Posted By Jim Flynn on February 4, 2008, 12:39 PM

I've known folks who had to have oxygen aboard an airplane. It was not their fault but the airlines charged them extra for special service to provide it. Providing extra seating space is also a legitimate charge for an obese person - whether they can help it or not. Sounds like a need for a federal rule for all airlines so that if one enforces it another can't profit by not.

Posted By Allan on February 4, 2008, 12:40 PM

There should be some wider sats either in the front by the bulkhead, in the middle by the wing door & or in the back for obese passengers w/c should cost more than the regular seats since they would be wider.

Posted By Mike Colcol on February 4, 2008, 12:41 PM

I have been seated in the middle seat next to a person of larger size which of course caused me to have less seat. I think people who are larger know they are larger they don't buy themselves twin beds at home so they are well aware that they either need to purchase 2 seats in economy or just purchase a seat in first class. This is something they are aware of - airlines could possibly offer vouchers for a nominally priced for X-large customers who actually have a medical reason that causes the obesity- to upgrade from economy seating to 1st class. It's unfair to the passenger that loses a portion of their seat due to someone of bigger size. It basically comes down to courtesy - you know what you weigh and you know the size of seats be courteous.

Posted By Joni Stone on February 4, 2008, 12:43 PM

Greed, that's all it comes down to. The share holders want big dividends so the airlines have to make cuts somewhere and the paying passenger is the one who suffers - regardless of build. If animals were packed in planes as humans are, there would be a lot of questions to answer. It's about time economy seats were a decent size. We all want comfort, but unfortunately not all of us can afford it.

Posted By Michele Motley on February 4, 2008, 12:43 PM

Obese people CHOOSE to be obese, and therefor should pay a higher hate for things associated with their larger size, if it 'space' is for sale, such as on an airplane.
Many people would argue that obesity is chosen, but working in the medical field has made my opinion a very strong one. It's only fair to the airline and other passengers to have a few larger seats on each plane for larger people, at a rate of what the 'space' would cost.

Posted By lori q on February 4, 2008, 12:44 PM

I agree a obese person should not have to pay for a first class ticket in order to be halfway comfortable on a flight...it would be nice if for a little more charge on top of you're original flight fee you could get a larger seat....I'm also tall and like the gentleman above my knees always hit the seat in front of me and I hate when the person in front of me lean their seat back it makes it almost unbearable especially on a long flight situation....But as I look around when flying and not even a thin person looks extremely comfortable on a flight so then how whould you regulate who actually gets to sit in those larger seats first some first serve or will they also weigh US when we check in?!?!

Posted By Sara Comer on February 4, 2008, 12:45 PM

How about working together on this? ATA has fat people who require 2 seats buy an extra ticket, then if there are ANY extra seats on that flight, their extra seat is refunded. And trust me, no fat person wants to sit next to a "fat-hater" any more than you want to sit next to us.

Posted By Sue on February 4, 2008, 12:47 PM

I recently travelled on an Air Transat flight to Mexico and encountered this situation. After Air Transat had rescheduled our flight at the last minute, and with an additional delay waiting for the aircraft to arrive at the airport, I walked on to the plane 12.5 hours later than expected and so not in a great mood. When I reached the exit row - that I had payed $70 extra to sit in - the extremely obese person seated next to me had lifted his arm rest so that he had taken his seat and 2/3 of my seat. I squeezed in for 1 minute between him and my husband on the other side and then got directly up and spoke to a Steward. Quietly and tactfully, I simply refused to sit there. I had paid for a full seat, not 1/3 of a seat. Before long passengers were rearranged and I was in another seat, across the aisle from my husband, still in the exit row. Leg room in the rest of aircraft was atrocious - this kind of sardining people into seats should be illegal - so I wasn't about to move out of the exit row. Seating this extemely obese person in the exit row should not be allowed. I have requested and sat in exit rows on many flights (never with Air Transat) and always was strictly questioned as to whether I was able-bodied or not. This doesn't seem to be an issue for Air Transat - I realize that fitting that person into any other seat (expect First Class) would have been impossible on that aircraft but this type of problem should be solved NOT to the endangerment (or even discomfort) of the rest of the passengers. In the case of an emergency, that person in the exit row would have been a liability to everyone trying to exit mid aircraft - whether he or Air Transat want to admit it, or not. That was my LAST Air Transat flight by the way.

Posted By Barbara Green on February 4, 2008, 12:47 PM

Obese - come on I could be obese if I ate lots of food but life is about choices - so I make a choice to hang around 138 lbs. while the passenger next to me who is spilling onto MY seat ate delicious rich chocolate cake with their lunch. Seriously though - I think airlines should have larger seats for obese people and charge them NO extra - lets face it we aren't going to be encouraged to get obese to get the bigger seat. If there are no obese people on the flight then the seat could be designated to say a mother with a toddler or whatever.
Why should we as passengers be uncomfortable because someone is in our "space" because of choices they made in terms of their lifestyle.

Posted By Kathy W on February 4, 2008, 12:47 PM

No matter what the person's size is that is flying, they should feel comfortable. Big or small it should not matter. To charge a larger size person more airfair is crazy, and it is discrimination. Again a question of society wanting everyone to conform to their standards. Yes it is healthier for a person to be "thinner" but there all kinds of reasons why a person is overweight. They should not have to answer to an airline or anyone else for that matter why they are the size they are. I too, am speaking from both sides, and from personal experiences have at times felt extremely uncomfortable flying with certain airlines because of my size. RIDICULOUS!

Posted By Lorena Loden on February 4, 2008, 12:48 PM

I wrote a long letter to UAL after having to spend much of an 11 hour flight standing because there wasn't enough room for me to sit comfortably in my assigned exit row seat. Not only did the large person next to me occupy much more than his "share" of the space, but I seriously doubted his ability to perform the required actions in the event of an emergency. He should not have been seated in an exit row, where everyone's safety might be dependent on him. UAL's response was, to put it politely, not helpful, perhaps because they thought that I would report them to the government.

I then suggested that they introduce X-class fares and configure the rear section of the airplane with wider seats for people who could not fit into the standard economy seats. Those larger people could sit in the X section with their companions. For those who are single, the X zone might even turn out to be a dating opportunity, where their collective relegation to a special section would be a conversation starter. My intent is to make the X section voluntary, but the flight attendants on a given flight might decide to move someone to that area if he/she were inconveniencing passengers seated in the non-X seats. The big question (pun intended) is what percentage of seats to allocate to the X section, recognizing that this approach reduces the number of seats on the plane. In this regard, it's not all that different from the old problem of assigning some number of rows to a smoking section.

I'm trying to find a way that balances the rights of large people with my right to have unimpeded use of the minuscule (and shrinking) amount of space allocated to me in today's economy section. I'm aware that we could propose lots of other ways to subdivide the cabins, but I'm trying to focus on just this one issue for now.

Posted By TonyW on February 4, 2008, 12:48 PM

Would this woman who complained about the overweight passenger have been happier to sit next to a small child (lots of seat room) and be poked, talked jibberish to and cried to for that flight? There are much worse seat buddies. We all chose to fly that flight and all must get along.

Posted By lorraine on February 4, 2008, 12:48 PM

If you need one seat, pay for one seat. If you need two seats, pay for two seats. If you pay for one seat, you pay for the entire seat, not two-thirds of it

Posted By Rick Feeney on February 4, 2008, 12:49 PM

With airfares as they are, we are paying $25 or more PER INCH of seat width. Passengers should not be expected to give up any of this precious real estate, nor should they be expected to subsidize bigger seats for the obese. Armrests that come down to seat level should be installed to eliminate oozing into someone else's seat. If you need more than one seat, buy two, and hold your ground when the airline wants to give your second seat to someone else. You wouldn't give it away if you bought it for your kid, would you?

Posted By John M on February 4, 2008, 12:49 PM

An obese passenger should purchase 2 tickets, if it takes 2 seats to accommodate her/his girth. I used to be obese, and I purchased 2 tickets for myself, only 1 of which was reimburseable by my company. But it was the right thing to do.

Posted By Patricia M on February 4, 2008, 12:50 PM

As an obese passenger, after reading these comments, I am beginning to feel as if I should never fly again and that I should stay home in my hovel, less I inconvenience anyone smaller than me walking down the street, by having to walk around me. If losing weight were easy, I would be 110lbs and a size 2 right now. Believe it or not, I don't sit around stuffing food in my face all day long. In fact I probably eat less than your average person on a daily basis, but weight has been a struggle for me, for years. But I love to travel. I am not made of money and I do everything in my power to try and make the entire flight experience more comfortable for everyone involved from trying to be upgraded to other classes to speaking with agents at the gate to attempt to find a seat that has an empty one next to it, but all flights seem to be flying at capacity these days. I sit by the window every time, I leave the arm rest down and try not to move at all, to the point of enduring actual pain in my legs after staying that way for hours. I don't necessarily spill over to the other seat but I fully fill out my seat and my thigh will touch anyone remotely heavy, that's sitting next to me. So what is my solution? I don't think the entire airline industry needs to cater to me but I do think that some regulations need to be employed. Maybe commit to leaving 2-3 seats empty a flight for these specific reasons. Or have a row that is only 2 seats wide, instead of three, in the same space two seats would take up on each flight and charge a nominal extra fee, like they do for overweight baggage, not a full price economy ticket. Require proof of weight in order to book those seats by having people reserve them and then showing up to the airport to prove that they are large enough to require them and if they are not, release them to other passengers. I just don't think there is anything productive in telling overweight people to basically lose weight or suck it up and stay home and stop making my life uncomfortable. It seems cruel and counterproductive to the airlines, as well. Imagine how much revenue they would lose if every overweight person stopped flying, when so much of the population is considered overweight/obese. It could cripple the industry and then none of us will have the chance to travel anywhere and that will be the real shame of it all.

Posted By Tracee on February 4, 2008, 12:55 PM

I fly often and really resent an overweight person taking up any of my seat space. Keeping the arm rest down is essential. If someone can't fit in a coach seat they should buy a first class seat, or take a bus! The idea that airline seats should be wider to accomodate obese persons is ridiculous. That would mean fewer seats on board and higher ticket prices for everyone.

Posted By David J on February 4, 2008, 12:56 PM

I can understand the inconvenience from both perspectives. Over the last two years I have lost 45 pounds. My flight experiences now are much more comfortable than before the weight loss. I never felt that I intruded upon the space of the person seated next to me, but truly felt uncomfortable leaning away from the middle seat, or being continuously bumped by the serving carts that rolled by. The reality is that the seats are too small anyway, and personal space just doesn't exist. But the few times I was seated next to an individual that was much heavier than I ever was, I truly felt like I may as well have had someone literally sitting on my lap the entire flight. Personally, this issue may necessitate charging significantly obese individuals for two seats.

Posted By Germaine Key on February 4, 2008, 12:57 PM

Lets get real here. When I fly I do not expect to be swaddled in an obese person's fat roll. When I pay for a seat, I expect to have all the room this entails without being encroached upon. Think of people like carry ons. If you wont fit in the bin, you wont go in the bin. First and foremost, obese people need to lose weight for their own health, and to avoid being a burden on the health care system. Short of that, they need to pay for ALL the space they take up, even if that means buying another seat to accomodate themselves.

Posted By Mike on February 4, 2008, 12:57 PM

First and foremost, all humans are to be treated with respect.

Now, airline passenger space is partitioned into seats with certain dimensions. That is unlikely to change due to economic factors, ie the bottom line.

Weight and SIZE are two different arguments. The main concern is of one person exceeding the space of their own seat and occupying that of a fellow traveler. If for safety reasons all passengers are prohibited from blocking the free egress of other passengers by obstructing the floor in a row and even requiring that trays be stowed away in an upright position for take offs and landings then this should naturally be a safety concern when involving individuals that exceed these limits be it for width or leg length.

Solution- reserve the front bulkhead seats for said individuals. No discrimination, just safety and comfort for all involved.

Remember the Golden Rule, treat others as you would like to be treated.

Safe and HAPPY flying!

Posted By Carlos on February 4, 2008, 12:58 PM

These comments posted here are very sad. Shame on those of you who live without compassion for others. Think of a situation you were in where you inconvenienced someone and could not help it.

Posted By Darla S on February 4, 2008, 12:59 PM

Let's look at this issue with a neutral prospective, without identifying oneself as obese or non-obese. Recently, I took a car ferry from Vancouver Island to Washington state. The ferry charged me more than a car because I had a truck which used up more space. Therefore, in fact, I was charged more and given more space for my truck. In the transportaion industry, space or weight, is the usual standard. I believe obese people should be charged more, but they should be given more space. It would not be too hard to install convertable seats that would allow three seats to convert into two seats which would accommodate two large people. Just as they check and weigh our luggage, it would not be too difficult to ask the over size passengers to step up on a scale and if they tip past 275 pounds, they would be required to pay the extra charge and, in fact, be given more space. Please provide feedback to my idea.

Posted By Robert on February 4, 2008, 1:01 PM

If the airlines don't take the initiative to solve this "growing" problem to the satisfaction of all of their customers, then it'll be just a matter of time before our Congress is forced to get involved, especially as airfares and the obesity rate continue to rise. No passenger should have to give up one inch of their already miniscule economy seating space to anyone else. So airlines....listen up....I recommend you solve the problem before a solution gets mandated to you.

Posted By Travis Jardon on February 4, 2008, 1:02 PM

My daughter and I were traveling from Newark to LAX and had to endure an extremely obese woman on the end seat, she 'did' have the arm rest down, but 'still' spilled over below and above so much, that my daughter had only 1/2 her seat available to her, thereby the two of us were squeezed into each other. It was horrible! The flight was full, and there was nothing they could do. I too agree that they should pay extra for taking up extra seating space, or the airlines should have a few oversized seats available at additional cost to them. It's not fair to the rest of us, because these people don't have any control over their eating habits. As an additional note, whatever you do..don't book your flight when a 'cruise tour group' is also on board..you will REALLY be in trouble! It's like traveling with the 'Biggest Loser' Group..eeek!

Posted By Dolores Giorgio on February 4, 2008, 1:06 PM

I try hard to be aware of how I might impact the person sitting next me -- WAY more than, when I was younger and smaller, older males who claimed the armrest like it was their birthright. My size has fluctuated greatly in the 30 years -- but my discomfort while flying hasn't. If you guarentee me my extra seat (and see the comments above about how well that happens), then I can see it. But I don't see the airlines guarenteeing me my extra seat.

Posted By jmg on February 4, 2008, 1:06 PM

From a big and tall gal ~ I wish there was consistency in seats from plane to plane and airline to airline. Don’t get me wrong, I don’t expect a twin engine beaver to have the same seat capacity as a 747 – but a 737 to DC 10 to 767 – there should be some, and from Delta to Delta, the seats always vary.

There are times I have room for my legs (I too have long legs) and times where I'm praying the person in front of me doesn't lean back because I'm already knee deep into their seat. I have been moved in seats for a taller person – but they only went by height – my thigh bone was definitely much longer. (They had the long torso and I happy to be more leggy). So – where was the equity in this?

Then, there is the width problem. I'm definitely LARGE. I’ve gotten the look once or twice from someone (luckily only that many times) who had to sit next to me. I have not extended over into their seat, but I have definitely had a bruise on my hips/legs after the flight from the armrest. I have had to use a seat belt extender two times (and not necessarily during the same trips, one leg yes - one leg no). So, I never know. I always hope that no one is next to me, or maybe I get an emergency or bulkhead row - but that's more for leg room. I am disabled (not counting obesity) and have to have leg room. (Medically and legally I have two compensable disabilities that severely affect my mobility and joints).

So, while I cannot afford first class, I can afford economy plus on some trips - but then the plane will not have a difference once I get on board. I don’t get a refund either, they say I am getting a better row assignment. I don't care what row I am in - by the bathroom or smelling first class cuisine - I'm paying for a larger seat and/or more leg room and half the time I don't get it. I just get closer to the exit. So, I would like consistency. And, I've sat next to plenty of rude skinny or in shape people too. Taking up the arm rest, bumping me (and believe me, like some others, when I sit, I don't move, I try to not even breathe in the other person's direction so I don't bother them. I also have the people who don’t mind coughing or sneezing in my direction – but I don’t do that back. And, the smokers – (I’m allergic) – do you have to reek of it when you get on the plane?

Would it help if I wore an “I’m disabled, honest. Please don’t hate me because I’m large. I chose the medication that made me heavier so that I could walk. And, please don’t sneeze on me, my immune system is compromised so that I can continue to move at all.” (I won’t even get into the flight attendants that are horribly mean to some guests and not mean to others. I could handle it if they were an all around jerk, but discriminators piss me off). And, no, I do not think thinner people should suffer by losing any of their seat to someone who is larger, but I also think all could be nicer. The armrest isn’t yours. It is to share. The leg room, limiting as it is, is mine. Please don’t sit with your legs so wide apart that they keep hitting mine (it actually hurts me because of my disability). Should these people be punished also? (In a lot of the points I am making, I’m referring to the few jerks, not those that actually need accommodations). I don’t mind you putting the trash on my tray. I don’t mind when you occasionally fall asleep and your head bobs onto my shoulder (unless you drool or smell). I’m actually pretty decent to sit next to, I’ll talk or not talk – up to you. My fat doesn’t seep over onto you or your seat, but I would venture to say it has at times taken up almost my half of the armrest (but it is ours to share, isn’t it?).

And yes, to the person who said seats haven’t shrunk – they have. I’ve been flying 40 years – lots of places. Seats vary. I was on an old plane in January and was very happy that I had leg room and butt room and it was cheapo economy. I kept hoping to catch the same plane home. I hope I never cause a problem by my taking up someone else’s seat – but I also hope I don’t have to sit next to some of the people who have written some terribly ugly comments on here. Not all obese people sweat or smell. I guarantee I don’t smell. I’ve been next to my fair share of thin, sweaty, stinky people. And, not all of us have a problem with the fork in our mouth.

I have no idea what the compromise is. I am sure if they had some larger seats, that there would then be a problem of “I’m larger than he/she is” or something like this. Or the skinny person wanting a larger seat for any number of reasons (legitimate and otherwise). Even at my thinner weight I’m still large, still have wide shoulders/hips and still have long legs, bones are bones. To reiterate, I would definitely pay more for more legroom/butt room – but want to be guaranteed I would get exactly that, not just a better row.

Posted By Denise Henderson on February 4, 2008, 1:11 PM

I personally have problems fitting in the seats and I am not considered obese, but I do have fairly broad shoulders. My dad used to bug me about looking like a linebacker, so I do everything I can to take up as little space as possible, on or off a plane, but when I can't afford a business class seat, I'm miserable.

I think airlines need to start making larger seats for everyone. Right now they are more interested in how many people they can cram on a plane instead of actually paying attention to the comfort level. If they made all the seats slightly larger, and then a person still took up more than their allotted space, then sure we should charge them for it.

Posted By Elizabeth Mays on February 4, 2008, 1:13 PM

Airlines restrict weight and charge extra for excess, simply because it costs more to handle it--and to pay for the extra fuel. Why should not overweight people be different? As a frequent traveler, I have the option to sit in escape rows, etc., but all too often recently the airlines have put the huge passengers in these seats, even though they are no wider than the regular seats. I agree with someone who said wider coach seats, at a premium, should be available, and I suspect people would pay for them for comfort's sake.

Posted By Andrew M. Johnson on February 4, 2008, 1:13 PM

Please, be realistic here. If you put an arbitrary obese or weight fee making passengers pay for an extra seat, then tall passengers will also have that problem. My husband is 6'2" and 250 lbs. He's not considered obese, but if the airline arbitrarily decided that passengers 250 lbs and more had to pay for an extra seat, we would not be able to afford to travel. Alternatively, does each gate agent get to decide who is obese and who's not based on their personal opinion? Where is the line drawn?

The 2-seat rows with each passenger in that row paying for the extra 50% of the middle seat if they want to would be the best option here (as opposed to an entire extra fare). If you are obese and know you will take up more then one seat, you should purchase the upgrade. However, if you are tiny but want to make sure no one (Tall, obese, smelly, loud, etc.) interrupts your comfort on a flight, you should also purchase the upgrade and stop complaining.

It's obvious that a lot of comments here are from people who have never had to deal with being obese and the daily struggle it causes. For many people it's due to genetics, and even a strict diet with regular exercise won't guarantee that you can become as thin as others think you should be. Some of the comments are absolutely disgusting and show no compassion for others.

Posted By Michelle M on February 4, 2008, 1:13 PM

what a silly question!!!!
the answer is simple: if one can pay extra charges weekly to support a larger than standard size buttocks, then one should also pay the extra charges to temporarily "stow" this ample accrual of extra flesh during transport...

this is not a case of discrimination, but of practicality...passengers are routinely charged fees for their over stuffed luggage...and..are not allowed to "carry" their supposed "carry -on " if it is larger than the alloted dimensions...this is merely a matter of the locale of the excess size and weight that is being transported....

extra "baggage" =extra cost...

Posted By catherine, not a skinny...nor a fatty on February 4, 2008, 1:14 PM

My husband slides somewhat into the next seat...luckily he doesn't have a job where he is confonted with the problem of putting someone else partially out of their seat and him being squashed. What we do when traveling to Europe every year is first of all: we book early and get an aisle seat for him and I take the middle seat --hoping another large person isn't sitting on the other side of me by the window. So far, that hasn't happened. He has to have the arm rest up to be comfortable which is okay with me, but I could understand how others would get upset with this situation when they, too, paid for their ticket. Wouldn't it be nice if the seats were a little wider as most people are crammed in the already tight seats, but I doubt if that will happen to soon. Although the new larger air bus type planes have wider seating then they have in some of the smaller planes.

Posted By karen on February 4, 2008, 1:14 PM

I think the airlines who want to squeeze as many seats as possible into the plane needs to evaluate what is the rigt size seat,for most of the people. I find there is not enough room for a normal size person to be comfortable on a long flight. I often do not move the whole flight as the people are crammed everywhere and trying to no avail to stand and move about.These days nearly all the flights are full so not moving is not good healthwise, for older people or overweight perople or thin people. Give the cattle more room and bigger seats if you care about everybody on the plane not just the wealthy.

Posted By Sheila Wunder on February 4, 2008, 1:18 PM

I have sat next to heavy/obese people before on many many flights. I notice they are super paranoid about invading my seat and try very hard not to. Average sized ignorant people bother me more. I fly everywhere for business and am constantly leaned on by Jane and John Doe. Also women with all the bags they can carry and magazines and crap. Do not get me started on your children and how THEY have the right to have toys, half eaten cookies and crap all over me as well. If obese should buy second seat so should people with kids and keep them in car seat or on your lap not mine. Oh and if you all can't keep your shoes on and insist on taking them off, buy odor eaters. I truly believe the obese people are more aware than the rest. I fly an average of 10x a month roundtrip.This I know.

Posted By Lorraine on February 4, 2008, 1:18 PM

Airline seats have shrunken in size over the years, and most people would enjoy travel more with greater leg room and seat girth. That doesn't diminish the responsibility of obese individuals to pay for what they require and end up taking from the rest of us. I agree with the suggestions to have some premium coach space that would better accomodate large people. I don't want to be punitive, only practical. In buying furniture, I have to pay a premium to find a sofa or chair that fits my petite stature, and I must often alter clothing to shorten sleeves and skirts or pant legs. We are not all one size, and we must pay to have things fit properly.

Posted By Carol on February 4, 2008, 1:19 PM

I'm sorry for the physical and mental stress obese people go through. I work constantly on maintaining a health weight (constant food monitoring, daily 3 mile runs) so I know it's hard. But I do not pay $300+ dollars for a seat on an airplane to have it half occupied by an obese individual. You are buying a SEAT on a plane. If you take up more than one seat, you must be prepared to pay for two. Period. We have gotten so PC in this country we're afraid to speak up for fear of offending someone and risking a lawsuit. Wake up! Yes, the airlines have made seats smaller - it's a business. If you know you aren't going to fit in one seat, either buy two, lose weight, or find another means of travel. When do the rights of those of us who do fit in one seat get addressed?

Posted By B Hart on February 4, 2008, 1:19 PM

Gosh! Now I realize what an invaluable service I perform by being fat! I give all you smug self-righteous characters someone to demean and feel superior to. I'll try to keep that perspective as I ride my bike or walk and listen to you folks drive by and shout insults and throw garbage at me.

Posted By Caroline on February 4, 2008, 1:25 PM

I think the responsibility lies with both parties. Ont he airlines side, they have indeed slowly shrunken the amount of space available for even a midsize person. I am a 5'8 woman of normal weight and I am physically uncomfortable either by width of seat, or leg room on many flights. There is a health issue here that the airlines should have to address. It is not only not healthy, but unsafe to have people strapped in such contraptions as considered seats. Yes you can move around, maybe, depending on the turbulence and the width of the isle. You can't even stand anywhere on most flights because you are either blocking the restroom or the flight attendent. DVT which can be fatal is a serious possiblity. You can't even move your legs in your seat anymore. SouthWest is a good example. The seat sizes for everyone should reverse significantly for all people. Most tall people and larger-girthed people would be greatly relieved along with the rest of us. First Class will remain first class because you recline and of course have a better meal and hot towels to wipe you fingers.....
Then after a point it does become the responsiblity also of the person. Having a row or two of plus-sized seats also could benefit everyone. They could be charged at a higher premium, though not nearly as costly as Buisness or First, perhaps even slightly less than United's Economy Plus. If know one uses them they could be given away (to people who don't ask) and would make some unsuspecting customers mightly happy, thus increasing return revenue. Airlines do have to contend with higher fuel prices just like the rest of us, but ultimately they have to contend with unhappy customers who end up flying with someone else. I believe you could make everyone much happier even if the situation is not perfect.

Posted By Jill W. Lowry on February 4, 2008, 1:26 PM

Airlines are out to make money - I don't blame them, and so make the seats as compact as possible to utilze the space for more seats. People know how big the seats are, and have the option of buying super economy and up, two economy seats, lose weight and buy one, or drive. That's the reality of it.

Posted By vanessa on February 4, 2008, 1:27 PM

1. How do you define obese? I'm 6'2" and weigh 280, but I am a very muscular person. People consistently guess my weight as 200 - 210. I don't overflow from my seat, but I would probably be classified as obese by a height/weight chart.
2. Obesity is a choice for most people. Prove you have a medical condition or pay extra.

Posted By Frank on February 4, 2008, 1:28 PM

In my opinion the obese passengers should not be discriminate .The seats in the air plans are way to small for little over average size not to say for bigger passengers. The seats should be at least 21" wide and have more leg room. Rite now we have to squeeze our body and if the flight is overseas , suffer for many hours and steal paid high ticket prices. I hope this type o situations will change for better very soon and the air lines make our flights as pleasure as possible..

Posted By Richard on February 4, 2008, 1:30 PM

Come on people there are too many prejudice people out there. I am a bigger person that does fit into an airplane seat. Is it my choice to be big? No. Do I eat a lot? No, actually I do not eat enough. Did I gain the weight because I ate too much? No, I was put on medication that makes me gain weight. You add bigger seats to the airplane and you are going to see skinny people in them. Give me a break and stop telling me that all bigger people eat too much.

Posted By Georgia on February 4, 2008, 1:32 PM

I can't believe some of the ignorant and prejudiced comments I have read on here. Yes, obesity is a choice for some people because they are unable or unwilling to stop eating, but that's not the case for everyone. I consider myself to be overweight but not so much that I spill over into the seats next to me. I compensate for it by choosing aisle seats and flying with airlines who offer larger seats, such as Southwest or American Airlines. Even when I was a size 6, I had all I could do to fit into the seats on Delta or US Airways flights! But regardless of whether or not obesity is a choice, airlines need to recognize that there is a problem and react accordingly. Asking people to purchase additional seats and then not allowing them to actually utilize that space is fraudulent in my eyes.

Posted By Keri on February 4, 2008, 1:32 PM

I am obese but working on losing weight and have lost 30 pounds so far. I always book an aisle seat on an airplane which gives me a little extra room. You don't ever need to get stuck in a middle seat and make everyone miserable. Get an aisle seat!

Posted By J. Williams on February 4, 2008, 1:32 PM

Airlines offer larger seats in first class. People of all sizes pay extra for more room and extra benefits in first class. Perhaps the airlines should offer larger seats in economy class at an increased price. Normal sized people have to pay extra if their luggage is over weight yet obese people who weigh twice or more than a normal weight travel for the same fare. Consequently, I don’t think it would be unfair to charge an obese person extra for a larger seat if they are taking up more space and adding extra weight. Airlines are a business not a charity. If the airlines are mandated to accommodate obese passengers, then they should address this issue in some manner that does not inconvenience me by allowing them to overlap into my seat.

Posted By Ginger Cole on February 4, 2008, 1:33 PM

One pays more for:
-Excess Baggage
-Large shoes
-Large clothes
-Large Meals
-Smoking
-Large autos
-Large homes
-Large parcel shipments
-Disability management
-On and on

Should I eat too much, I expect to pay more. Have you ever seen an overweight POW and those in death-camps? No food means no fat.

And, airlines sometimes fly aircraft over gross weight limits because the old FAA standard per passenger no longer applies. Not good.

If one "uses" something, they should pay for it... that goes for all seats too. I fly alot, and I am spring-loaded to get off if someone is taking too much of the space I paid to enjoy... almost did it on Delta last month.

Solution: "diet"!

Posted By J. M. Gambill on February 4, 2008, 1:33 PM

while having some extra larger seats on the planes at a slightly higher price for that section does seem like a viable option, it doesn't address the fact that all airlines currently have fixed fleets, including many airplanes that have been in the air for years and aren't due to be retired for many more. The cost of taking these planes out of service and retrofitting them is prohibitively expensive, which is going to drive up everyone's ticket price, not just the tickets of those who are overweight. Having flown extensively internationally, I can tell you that the two-seat issue is almost exclusively an American problem. It does not make good economic sense for the aviation industry to radically alter plane designs for an issue that only exists in one part of the world (though the exportation of our lifestyle is causing rising obesity in the UK and other places). The vast majority of overweight Americans need to accept that obesity is due to their environment and lifestyle and stop treating themselves as genetically unlucky or disabled. Very, very few people have "glandular" problems that cause that kind of obesity. For everyone else, get out of the car, up from in front of the TV and stop eating such huge portions and so much sugar, you'd be amazed how quickly the weight comes off. There's no reason why anyone should pay more for a problem that has it's roots in overconsumption to begin with - try treating the problem by eating and spending less.

Posted By kristin on February 4, 2008, 1:34 PM

There is a lot of prejudice against overweight people. You can see it in all the comments above. Who seriously believes that if it was THAT easy to lose weight, we would all be skinny? Fat people do not WANT to be overweight - do people honestly believe that obese people would choose to be ostracized by others in society, to be ridiculed, to be embarrassed when they can't fit into public seating (be it theater, bus or airplane), to struggle to find clothing that fits, to be looked down upon and treated poorly because of their physical features?

There's a variety of reasons that people are fat. Yes, sometimes it's due to eat too much/exercise too little. Sometimes it's disease. Sometimes it's poor health. And sometimes - often - it's due to the fact that our food sources are loaded with sugars, fats and a wide variety of chemical additives that are affecting our bodies in ways we barely have begun to understand.

I can tell you from experience that I have struggled against all my life. Even when I was in high school, playing 3 very active varsity sports a year and eating "right", I couldn't get my weight down. As an adult, it is something I struggle against constantly, and the barrage of media showing "non-existant is sexy" and the social stigmatism against fat people doesn't help.

I have been flying for nearly 30 years and have seen a lot of changes go into the industry.

Like everywhere, the airlines are profit-driven; this is no surprise. But airlines have, over the years, shaved more and more room off economy-class seats - a quarter inch here, a half inch there, while taking away the "perks" one by one (meals, drinks, refreshment packs, etc). Meanwhile - business and first class - the echelon of business travelers and the true cash-cows of the industry - get more and more space dedicated to them, and some of the top-end first class amenities are so amazing it's practically in the realm of "so awesome, you forget you're flying public transportation".

Don't get me wrong; I've flown business or first class when my budget (or frequent flyer miles) have allowed it, and I cherished every single moment.

And it is not simply overweight people who have to deal with these magically-shrinking seats; it is pregnant women and disabled people and tall people. My brother is 6'2" and as fit as he can be, but he's almost always uncomfortable in coach because there's simply no leg room anymore. (Anybody remember People's Express? We flew that once and he couldn't even put his tray down any more than 1/3 of the way).

What's really unfortunate is that people who are sitting in aisle seats cannot put up the armrest of the aisle side (they'll be told they're "blocking the aisle"), and those sitting against the window cannot put up the armrest next to the window, either. (I'm curious to know... just how much leg pressure affects an airline?) So when people sitting in either of these seats need a little more room, it's either squish the person in the middle seat, or cram yourself up into as small a space as possible and hope you aren't delayed too much.

Do you know how embarrassing it is to have the flight attendant come around with drinks or a meal, and you can't even put your tray down over your lap? That affects not only fat people but pregnant women as well! That's a design flaw, one easily remedied, but which nobody chooses to do anything about.

Let's not even get into airline bathrooms, which have shrunk and shrunk over the years. I want to assume that this is to prevent people from doing the "mile-high club" thing, but honestly, why are airline bathrooms designed so the only ones who can efficiently use them are men? If you're a woman, even a thin one, it's getting to be a squeeze to sit down and do what one needs to do.

I'm in support of making a few rows in economy of each plane be suitable for plus-sized customers. But here's the problem with the idea of larger economy-sized seats for those who genuinely, physically need them (obese; pregnant; or physically disabled): if they're the same price or even just a little bit more than the rest of the economy seats (let's say a $50 fee over whatever lowest fare you choose to pay), what's the stop people who don't physically require the extra space, but who simply want the extra space so they get a "business-sized seat at economy costs" from gobbling up those seats? I know that I would be pretty ticked off to be told that the "plus-size economy" seats were "sold out" only to get on the plane and see people who clearly did not require the extra space sitting there.

So what, then? Would travelers be required to register to wear a little round badge, signaling to the world that they have the right to those seats?

And if that's the case, then why not have rows for the extra-skinny? If you're size 2, then you can pay less and sit in a smaller seat. Fair's fair, right?

Posted By Melime on February 4, 2008, 1:35 PM

I am not an attorney but I belive when a airline offers a seat for sale that is the price. I think
that it is unfair for a person to show up and then be assesed a extra fee. It is an unfair practice. I believe that they could ask your weight when you purchase the ticket and asses the fee when they ticket you.

Posted By C. A. Terwilliger on February 4, 2008, 1:37 PM

I have had the unfortunate luck to be in a middle seat between two very large individuals on a plane where there were no empty seats to which I could move. While I believe that everyone should be able to fly, I also believe that grossly obese people should be charged for the space they occupy whether it be one and half or two seats. Requiring individuals over a certain weight or girth measurement to so state should be made part of the ticketing process so that airlines would know how many seats will be occupied. If the passenger fails to comply with the requirement and shows up for the flight they should not be allowed on the plane. I know that that will create some problems and some people will scream discrimination but what about the poor passenger that has to suffer through two or more hours with little room to move or breathe.

Posted By John Riconda on February 4, 2008, 1:37 PM

It's a matter of common sense. One seat paid, one seat used. It should apply to all.

Posted By Johannes on February 4, 2008, 1:42 PM

How about seating the obese together? Collect body weight info when ticketing, and sit the obese in the same rows (make sure to avoid unbalancing the plane). That way, they can deal with it together. If you have unmatched rows, offer compensation to (normal weight) people who volunteer to sit next to an obese person, in exchange for the discomfort and inconvenience.

Posted By M. Villasin on February 4, 2008, 1:44 PM

Sadly, our ability as a county to govern ourselves is going to cause a 2nd party to do it for us. If you are obese and take up more than one seat, be considerate to your fellow traveler and buy two.
It's that simple - be considerate.

Posted By John on February 4, 2008, 1:45 PM

While I have compassion for obese people, it isn't fair to other paying passengers to have someone invading their already minimal space. I once had the dreaded middle seat on a trip from LA to LONDON. I was between two overweight people in an already uncomfortable seat. It was painfully miserable. I'm all for airlines having a few rows of plus-sized seats at a slightly higher price. A predetermined minimum weight (so others wouldn't take advantage in order to get a larger seat for less than 1st Class prices) would require these seats to ensure everyone's comfort.

Posted By J Batson on February 4, 2008, 1:45 PM

Wow, this is a sensitive and passionate issue. I'm a plus sized gal, working on getting it off but don't bleed over into another's seat. However I have had it happen to me. I had hip surgery and as anyone who has had it knows it doesn't take much to pop that thing out and when you do, it requires another surgery. I had the bulkhead isle seat and the middle and window seat were taken up by ONE person! They had to give her 5 extentions so the seatbelt would fit, she seemed totally undisturbed by the fact she should have had my seat too. I begged to be let off the plane or moved but the flight was 100% full and I was told it was too late to deplane even though the door was still open. I got up and stood as much as I could at the first part of the flight but we had turbulance and I had to attmempt to fit into what was left of my seat. She was on the bad-hip side of me and went to sleep. Her arms were bigger than my thighs so when she shifted her weight she crushed my hip and me. I screamed in pain and was told to be quiet by the flight attendants. I endured this for what seemed to be forever, crying quietly because the flight attendants told me to be quiet, hours later when we landed I had to be taken off the plane by ambulance and had to have another hip replacement surgery, had several blood clots in my leg from being PINNED under her and my ribs were cracked. I spent a month in the hospital recovering, years of therapy and still not the same. I sued the airline because they refused to allow me to exit the plane (there was time believe me) and thus put my safety and wellbeing in danger. But that will never ever make up for the damage to my body, the pain I had to endure then and now and the fact one leg is shorter than the other so I can no longer run or hike like I used to. She did not pay but for one seat but took up 3 really. Was that fair? No! I paid for my seat and I want 100% of my seat! Not 90%, and in this case certainly not 10%! They are appealing the case but they KNEW she was not a tall person of muscular build she was not much taller than me, she was just big. I understand taller people need the leg room and I have traded seats with them, being sensitive to the fact they can't help being tall. I don't know how the airlines will address this; taking ones body mass is not the way nor weighing people.

I now pay extra to fly business or use miles to bump up first class and insist on the isle that is on the side of my bad hip. Otherwise, I don't go.

Posted By Veronica on February 4, 2008, 1:48 PM

The fault is with the airlines. Americans keep getting bigger and taller and the seats keep getting smaller with less legroom. I am tall and female and am always terribly uncomfortable when I fly. I don't see how men who are usually larger and taller tolerate it, let alone fat people.
The bottom line is GREED. Flying has become on a par with cross-country bus travel. Not one iota of "class" left in the experience.

Posted By Linda on February 4, 2008, 1:48 PM

Smokers can't smoke on a plane (an addiction). Folks with overweight luggage have to pay a large amount of money for the weight. Why should an obese person (the result of a food addiction) get away with their fat for no charge and inconvenience passengers around them, or create a new seating class and let them and the screaming babies entertain each other. AS baby would fit in the seat next to one of these large people

Posted By Ardie on February 4, 2008, 1:52 PM

I weigh 145 pounds, so I do not face discrimination for being big. However, I believe that the last "legal" discrimination existing in this country is against the overweight. The attitude is "you are that way because you are weak". Wrong. Dead wrong. I know several obese people and none of them want to be that way. Most of them have tried every diet and weight loss scam advertised on TV, to no avail. Some are even having surgery to try to reduce their size.

Don't make it worse for them. I believe they should get the same "reasonable accomodation" as those in wheel chairs or with oxygen tanks.

Southwest Airlines is probably the worse offender in singling out the obese for redicule. Their gate agents can stop anyone they want and not let them board without buying another ticket.

As others above have pointed out, the major problem lies with the airlines. Over the years their seats have shrunk and shrunk while the size of people has grown and grown.

Posted By Ramon on February 4, 2008, 1:53 PM

I like Southwest Airlines' solution-- those obese enough to need 2 seats need to purchase them.

If there are empty seats on the plane, the cost of the second seat is refunded.

If not, both the obese person and her/his neighbors are spared discomfort and embarrassment.

Posted By Honey Ward on February 4, 2008, 1:53 PM

I cannot believe there is not one comment on here about the fact that some people who are considered legally obese are that way due to genetics...not just overeating! I know many thin people who eat like cows and whatever they want and never gain a pound. Everyone is different in some way, short, tall, fat, skinny, pretty, ugly.... tolerance and consideration is what we all need. The airlines should make their seats to accommodate the majority of the population which are generally overweight and those that are excessively overweight, know their situation and pay for extra seat or 1st class. It's not right for them to disrespect others rights to their full seat.

Posted By Mona on February 4, 2008, 1:56 PM

I'm astounded to learn that persons purchasing 2 seats have had their careful and considerate plans undone by airlines wanting to squeeze in one more fare. When this happens, each of the 3 people packed into a row deserves a total refund -- that would be 4 free fares, and it might make the airline pay attention. I think it's clear from this conversation that most large people would pay a fair ratio of extra fare for extra space, short of the 300 or 400% premium for first class, if such seating were available. Even the harshest of the comments above have concluded that airlines should have some larger seats to sell. That's where the solution has to begin. Honestly, if all coach configurations went from ABC DEF to AB CD, and average fares rose proportionately from $250 to $375, we would all still fly. Please don't say Congress has to get involved to make this happen!

Posted By P.S. Bailey on February 4, 2008, 1:56 PM

The fault is with the airlines. Americans keep getting bigger and taller and the seats keep getting smaller with less legroom. I am tall and female and am always terribly uncomfortable when I fly. I don't see how men who are usually larger and taller tolerate it, let alone fat people.
The bottom line is GREED. Flying has become on a par with cross-country bus travel. Not one iota of "class" left in the experience.

Posted By Linda on February 4, 2008, 1:57 PM

I was 400 lbs. I tried to get Delta to let me buy 3 tickets for my wife and myself. They would not.
All I wanted was for it to count as two three tickets for the purpose of frequent flyer. If they had extra need for my tickets because of overbooking, then they could upgrade us to first class. It seemed like a win win situation. I would pay extra for the room and they would receive extra for the same amount of weight they were carrying. This sounds reasonable. It sounds like a way to make extra money for nothing. This is probably why Delta had so much financial troubles. These executives make so much money, they don't care about anyone else. By the way, I now weigh 220 lbs. Maybe one of these days, the executives would care to sit next to a person like I was.

Posted By Jim on February 4, 2008, 1:58 PM

Airplane safety can be compromised by too much weight; this is a fact and there are FAA regulations that pilots and airlines have to follow. Especially with today's smaller, regional planes, the plane cannot be overweight when it leaves the gate. This is why airlines are so concerned about so many overweight suitcases today and you have to pay extra for them. I was recently on a flight where several standy passengers had to be turned away because too many students returning to college had brought overweight bags and paid the fee. There were EMPTY SEATS on that plane and I needed to get on it because of a death in the family. I was allowed on WITHOUT my suitcase, due to persistence and, I am convinced, because I am petite. That gate agent looked me up and down and I volunteered my weight because I knew he was thinking "maybe I can let her on". Clearly, weight IS an issue and it's not just about comfort. The airlines are responsible for the weight they allow onboard and they will have to come up with a way to deal with this effectively and proactively, so passengers aren't left at the gate. For this reason, a weight limit MAY be a reasonable approach. The FAA does not impose SIZE limits and weight may be the only thing they can use to objectively place limits.I know there are situations where obesity is due to genetic or other heatlh conditions but the overwhelming majority of obese Americans allow themselves to ve so. It is all over the news how we have an epidemic of obesity in America. If you travel to Europe or Asia you will not see a lot of obese people. This is about Americans choosing excess and McDonalds. I think the airlines should set a reasonable weight limit and charge for the seat next to those over the limit, just like they do with the baggage. Sorry, but on a plane, weight is weight, it doesn't matter what it comes from.

Posted By Mary on February 4, 2008, 2:00 PM

I wouls agree that the airlines should have oversized seats that would accomadate an obese preson. They could charge a little more than one coach but less than two cvoach seats.
As we have become an obese nation(my self include) these appears to be an ongoing problem.
As for Cindy loosing her paid for seat ,she should have been reimbursed as she was "BUMPED"

Posted By Basil on February 4, 2008, 2:02 PM

I too am heavier person and I am embarrassed in such small seats and do hate to fly US flights. I would certainly opt to pay a bit extra for larger seats if they were available and I certainly am happy for those that can "opt for healthier life styles" or enjoy being thin. But I won't be a skinny minnie if it comes with that attitude. I do feel sorry fortall people too trying to fly--at least headroom is not a problem for me (only 5ft 2)

Posted By Linda Bennett on February 4, 2008, 2:03 PM

I think if you take up more than one seat, pay for it. If you paid for 2 seats, dont give them up to encroachers either. But ThANK YOU to all the obese people who are at least CONSIDERATE of the folks next to them! Good manners can go a long way!
But at some time it has to come down to weight issue/fuel costs and safety. If you've ever flown in general aviation, there is a weigh limit or the plane cant get off the ground. Everything has its limits including commercial jets.

Posted By Janet on February 4, 2008, 2:03 PM

1st: the airlines keep shrinking the seat size and leg room, then charging us extra for what was once a "normal" seat.

2nd: I am not overweight and I'm 5'9" but even I find the usual seats too small.

3rd: the best thing I ever saw as to an overweight person on NWA -- a very large woman was in the center seat and a very small man was on the aisle. The man was very gracious and kind to the very obese woman who was squishing him into about 1/2 a seat. After the plane doors closed the flight attendent beckoned to the man and moved HIM to 1st class! Now THAT was classy!

Posted By Judy on February 4, 2008, 2:05 PM

Listen, this is a simple issue people. If the airline order wider seats with more legroom this would not be a problem. If you do not know airplanes are configured to client's ie. airlines specifications. They could make flying more comfortable but CHOSE not to do so because they want to pack as many bodies in as possible for higher profits. I have refused to pay for 2 seats this is ridiculous! I do not know if any of you are aware but all planes could be retrofitted to be more comfortable as we speak but that costs MONEY and the airlines are hanging on by a wing and a prayer, pun intended! We need federal intervention people to address far greater problems with flying like long delays, near misses and crashes and an outdated FAA tracking system. Let's get some perspective here. However if you want your flying experience to me more comfortable you better be prepared to pay for it. So if your on a discounted ticket you should be glad they pass you those stale peanuts! This is the cold harsh reality. Until it gets worse or there are more crashes nothing will be done. Welcome to the UNfriendly skies!

Posted By Flying Fatty on February 4, 2008, 2:10 PM

First let me say I am 120lbs and am 5'0" tall so I am not obese nor am I tall. It is not appropriate for airlines to charge people extra because they are not skinny or short. It is up to the airlines who make their living transporting passengers to and from destinations to accommodate them. That is the service they are providing whether they are short, tall, skinny or obese. In addition, I too have been uncomfortable in such tight quarters because airlines have cut seat size and leg room size just to squeeze in more seats so they can make more money on the additional seats. No matter how you look at the situation they are giving you less quality for the same amount of money (if not charging you more money for less). Years ago there was plenty of room for everyone -- what happened. In addition, why should only the elite passengers who can afford first class seats be comfortable. It is discrimination to charge more plain and simple.

Posted By Martha Rubino on February 4, 2008, 2:11 PM

I think that following a policy of having someone who is grossly obese pay for 2 seats is a fair policy. I also think providing a few extra size seats (at a different price) would be a workable solution. I spent an entire cross country flight standing in the rear galley of a plane because the man seated next to me was so grossly overweight I couldn't move my arms at all. He was using several belt extenders. There were no empty seats to move to. The flight attendants were sympathetic. They apologized for the problem and let me stay in the galley as there was nowhere to move. I stood the entire flight, reading my book. I only returned to my seat for the landing. The man who was the cause of my "inconvenience" was oblivious to the problem. I almost think he deliberately took over more than 50% of my seat to try to get me to move and leave him free to fully occupy both seats.

Posted By Georgia 2 on February 4, 2008, 2:16 PM

We haven't even begun to address the unfairness regarding checked luggage. I believe everyone should be given an X pound allowance. If you want your allowance to be taken up by your girth then so be it. I, however, do not appreciate getting charged a $50 overweight fee when my bag is 10 pounds over, yet I weigh 110 pounds. That person sitting next to me and using half my seat, weighing in over 300 pounds was already granted free excessive luggage of the belly. They should be charged for excessive weight if they charge me for excessive weight of luggage.

Posted By Kara B on February 4, 2008, 2:16 PM

No one wants to be uncomfortable when they fly. Larger seats would be nice but with today's trents, that is clearly not going to happen. If a person has to buy 2 seats then airline personnel should enforce their space. It seems that people who have been considerate enough to buy 2 seats have been burned. We need to go back to a time when airlines treated customers like people and not a herd of cattle to be crammed in at all costs. Without having a weight restriction and weighing every person before their flight how do those of you harsh ones expect the surcharge to be enforced? Speaking of harsh, can we have a stupidity surcharge as well? What is an "epedemy"? If you are going to be mean at least be smart about it. Throwing in "thus" does not make you intelligent. You know who you are.

Posted By Sandra on February 4, 2008, 2:17 PM

Anytime you ship a package, you are charged by weight and/or volume. The same should apply to shipping yourself. It's a simple calculation. Of course that would mean 'weighing in' at the airport because people are prone to fibbing about their real weight, myself included. But you've already got your shoes off anyway, why not just install a scale under the metal detector (or something like that!)

Posted By Chris on February 4, 2008, 2:20 PM

No, I don't think obese people should be charged any extra. They're already discriminated in the workplace beyond all measure...they're often simply not hired, and when they are hired, they're usually paid less than their counterparts. So, since they are already often economically disadvantaged, paying them a surcharge for their plight is completely unjust. If you charge the overweight extra, then you have to charge smokers too. Sure, the smokers don't smoke on the plane, but their breath is often bad enough to knock me out...and they're breathing out all their infested breath. Make all smokers take a breathelyer, then make all alcoholics take a blood test and/or breathlyzer to measure their alcohol content, since they're liable to drink the flight away in oblivion and drive me nuts sitting next to me. If you're going to stick it to the fat people, then stick to the smokers who smell, and alcoholics who are obnoxious, and the old people who also often smell, by virtue of being old.

Posted By Joe Heller on February 4, 2008, 2:20 PM

Airplanes are not built to accomodate large or tall people. I am very tall and have similar problems on flights. I can't sit with me knees in front of me - I must spread my legs to get my knees in between the seat cracks. Heaven forbid someone tilts their seat back. I know that my legs are spilling over to the people on either side of me and it is embarassing but certainly there is nothing that can be done on my part. The airlines should allow more room both in front and on the sides. Airplane travel is VERY uncomfortable for anyone that is over 5'6" and 160 pounds!

Posted By Rhonda on February 4, 2008, 2:23 PM

If someone needs more space than available in one seat they should have to pay for it. Since airplane seats are so small maybe the airlines should make available 3 seats for 2 bulbous people.

I am not tall but one time flying between London and Seattle my knees were against the guy's back in front of me and the guy's knees behind me were in my back. Thanks to British Airways and the 747 set-up.

There should be some way for Aircraft manufacturers and Airlines to address this but like some people say it is just "greed" and that will not end soon. I heard that the new Boeing 787 Dreamliner was going to have extra spacing but the airlines said "NO, we'll use that space for more seats." GREED!

The only current answer that I can see is charge for extra space when it is needed and that should be the responsibility of the airline. The obese people will not usually admit their total size any more than the average woman admits her age, etc.

HOLD THE AIRLINES ACCOUNTABLE OR IT WILL NEVER CHANGE!

Posted By Roger Farrell on February 4, 2008, 2:23 PM

I'm an obese person and think what airlines like Southwest do, charging extra for overweight people, is discrimination. They wouldn't dare try to charge extra for a disabled person using a wheelchair. Normal-sized people are cramped in airplanes nowadays, so airlines should put less seats in all planes, make it more roomy, and just charge everyone a little more.

Posted By Douglas on February 4, 2008, 2:23 PM

I had a long flight with an obese person next to me, it was a very long uncomfortable flight. I paid full price and had to sit with my hand between my legs for the person next to me hung over into my space. I was unable to lift my arm to get to my drink or change the channel on the TV. It is not however the large persons fault only for my situation, the airlines should stipulate a weight limit and anyone over that weight or largr than the measurements of the seat should be required to purchase a second seat. It is not fair for someone else to be inconvenience or uncomfortable because of anothers persons situation. Everything in life has consequences and this hould be another one. We made major changes in federal and local courts about smokers and their infringing on other non smokers, this falls into the same category, as well as not allowing people to wear perfumes and colognes in some work places due to the annoyance of others. Put the situation and responsibilty where it belongs.

Posted By Debra Boccarossa on February 4, 2008, 2:24 PM

The concept of charging larger people more for flying is disgusting. It was not an issue before the airlines replaced the seats with miniaturized versions. It is unhealthy for anyone to be crammed into a tiny area while flying and this should be banned.

People should not be discriminated against based on their size, height, race, gender, sexual orientation, country or origin, etc.

Discrimination is just that. It disgusts me that there is even a conversation about whether this is 'right or wrong'.

Grow a heart and some compassion.

Posted By Elizabeth Madrigal on February 4, 2008, 2:24 PM

Airlines could have some extra large seats available for obese people so that the people sitting next to them don't have to be uncomfortable . In my opinion, they would be justified in charging a premium for those seats. Most people could lose weight if they joined weight watchers and seriously followed the program. (I am a WW member myself. Maybe these seats could be placed in the back row or rows.

Posted By Diane on February 4, 2008, 2:26 PM

If a passenger does not fit in the seat without intruding into the next seat(s), he/she should either purchase a first class ticket or purchase two economy tickets. The airline should enforce this. Neither the airline nor other passengers should be responsible for the lifestyle of obese people.

Posted By Edgar Kranzer on February 4, 2008, 2:28 PM

If a passenger does not fit in the seat without intruding into the next seat(s), he/she should either purchase a first class ticket or purchase two economy tickets. The airline should enforce this. Neither the airline nor other passengers should be responsible for the lifestyle of obese people.

Posted By Edgar Kranzer on February 4, 2008, 2:30 PM

I work out every day, running between 5 to 15 miles a day. I watch what I eat and am in great shape.

Either lose weight or pay to sit in two seats.

Posted By Linda Gau on February 4, 2008, 2:31 PM

Obesity is a choice. There is a solution. Stop eating so much bad stuff and get healthy. Flying is a convenience, not a privilege. Seats airlines provide are a convenience. If you have a super big butt then fly first class and pay for that privilege of a bigger seat.

I am a very long legged 6'4" and some airline seats don't even allow me to sit in them, physically. so if I'm going to fly them I ask for an exit row which is normally given. My condition is not solveable. Being obese is. Also at 260 lb I'd be happy to pay a small premium because I'm too heavy. But I fit width wise just fine.

Posted By RFay on February 4, 2008, 2:31 PM

So, according to some on here obese people should just stop eating in order to be thin? No muscle as they wouldn't have any energy to exercise from not eating, but by golly they'd be thin enough to compensate for the other little midgety thin people who think they're high and mighty and fit correctly into seats? Give me a break people - get a life, stop complaining about what people look like and look at how you're acting and thinking - if you were faced with an obese person I doubt you'd say the things you're saying on here. RUDE!

Posted By Tracy D on February 4, 2008, 2:31 PM

I work out every day, running between 5 to 15 miles a day. I watch what I eat and am in great shape.

Either lose weight or pay to sit in two seats.

Posted By Sue on February 4, 2008, 2:32 PM

I feel sorry for obese people, but it IS something that can be changed. If they can not fit into one seat, that is not my problem. I paid for all of my seat and I deserver 100% of it. Nothing less.

But, I do agree that the seating in current airplanes is really small. An earlier poster said some seats should be set aside that have more room. Sure, they cost more, but I would pay more for that also...even though I am not a larger person. EVA airlines does this and I take advantage of it whenever I can!!!!

Posted By Craig T on February 4, 2008, 2:33 PM

It is the responsibility of the airline. Seats should come in different sizes with weight and height limits for each class of economy seats. Some arilines already have economy plus seats. My husband is big and I have encouraged him to pay the extra for a plus seat. I have seen very tall men sit with their knees around their chins in middle seats on long flights while tiny senior citizens who did not appear to be strong enough to perform the required duties sat in emergency exit rows. Let's give the people who need extra room bigger seats and make them pay for it. A couple of hundred dollars is nowhere near the price of a business or first class upgrade. There are folks who don't 'need' the extra room who would be willing to pay a premium just to be more comfortable.

Posted By Carol on February 4, 2008, 2:36 PM

My biggest complaint is that many airlines have done away with the planes that seated 2-4-2 in economy. Those seats were comfortable, even in one's in the 4 across row.
The worst planes I've ever flown are TED to FL. Talk about crammed in. Even economy plus was a joke. I felt like I sat with my knees under my chin. And you'd think that a flight from Anchorage, Alaska would use a wide body plane, but no. Economy plus offers more leg room but it's the same seat as all the other planes.
On one flight to FL a few years ago the reservationist somehow gave me an aisle seat instead of the window. I was lucky since the 6'6" guy they put in the window seat was grateful to switch seats with me.
I really think the airlines should have at least six to nine seats available for the tall and the overweight and people with infants. And when they board the plane show them to these seats. Take out the armrests and put two overweight people in the three seats. Have the airlines considered that? We aren't flying to FL this year, we're driving!! Nancy

Posted By Nancy Gomez on February 4, 2008, 2:38 PM

How about the airlines stop being so greedy and actually create space for the majority to fit comfortably! For what we are all paying, we should be comfortable!

I recently flew from Arizona to Atlanta - seats three across. I wouldn't consider any of us three to be obese in the sense that this article is written, but none of us were thin either. We all sat with our shoulders touching and little room to move at all. I'm sorry, but when an average airfare in the states is somewhere between $300 and $600, a comfortable seat should be expected!

How about the airlines either take out the last two rows and separate the seats more that way for tall people, and do either 2 and 2 or 3,2, 2 and spread the seats out a little.

Posted By Debbie on February 4, 2008, 2:38 PM

I agree that the airlines have decreased the size of their seats and have put the rows closer together making it uncomfortable for most passengers - obese or not. While the majority cannot afford 1st class seating I think that there should be a few seats in coach that are larger with additional leg room and at no increase in price. This would be a hugh benefit for the tall traveler as well as the obese or handicaped, especially on overseas flights. Of course the obese or tall person should not be forced to sit in the larger chairs, but I would image if given the choice, they would not hesitate....thus making the flying experience a little more enjoyable for all. If the airlines cannot or will not offer a few larger chairs, then I think the extremely obese person should purchase 2 seats, but be given a discount - or at the very least if they cannot afford the added costs and that person takes up half of your seat, then the airline should reimburse you 100% or find you another seat.

Posted By Debbie Richter on February 4, 2008, 2:38 PM

The problem with having a few larger seats on an airplane is that everyone will want to sit there, and they will fill them up before somebody that actually needs it can book it. Everyone who has ever flown as seen the 120 lb. person in the exit row, and they always say that they just like the extra room. They say that they are entitled to the bigger seat. I think the general public would be appalled at of the attitudes of some passengers on airlines. They expect to be pampered and waited on hand and foot, and they expect preferential treatment.
There are a lot of problems with flying. Most of them would go away if people just used a little common courtesy with each other. How many times have you gotten onto a plane that was only half full but all the overhead bins were full? That happens because people take on more carryon luggage than is allowed, and the gate agents don’t stop them. You’ll find a lot of times that the people who do this are also the ones who are complaining the most.
I'm a decent sized guy, with broad shoulders, and I have been seated next to larger people before. We just try and accommodate each other and deal with it. A little courtesy goes a long way. No, it is not comfortable, but we are all inconvenienced when we fly.
The airlines are not building planes to be comfortable. They are building planes to get as many people on board as possible. I am six foot tall, and once I am in my seat I have no wiggle room, so to speak. My knees are in the back of the seat in front of me. I can’t imagine somebody 6’4” or more trying to sit on an airline seat.
In the past airlines were not flying full capacity flights everywhere. There used to be empty seats, and the flight attendants could move people around to make them more comfortable. That is not the case anymore.
Do I think that heavier passengers should be charged more? No I don’t, because who is to say that somebody is overweight or oversize? Many people think that somebody who is 10 pounds heavier than they are should lose weight. Just keep in mind that people 10 pounds lighter than you are thinking the same thing about you.

Posted By Dudley on February 4, 2008, 2:40 PM

Personally, I'm so sick of people expecting to be treated as if they're "special" (refunds, etc.) just because they're obese. I'm also sick of being crowded by oversized people sitting next to, behind or in front of me. I think the airlines should definitely charge [unhealthily] obese people for two seats. On top of that, they should charge a penalty for the inconvenience caused to other people by their weight problem. It is and should remain exactly that: THEIR problem, not mine or other passengers'.

Posted By Betty S. on February 4, 2008, 2:40 PM

My husband and I (and our adult children) are very tall. We are already cramped in a regular economy seat and if an obese person is seated adjacent, we are all in for a very bad flight. Flying first class is not an option and we avoid charters altogether. Airlines must start offering some longer leg room and larger seats, both for "big and tall" as well as disabled passengers. And we will be happy to provide height and hip size to qualify!

Posted By jessie on February 4, 2008, 2:42 PM

Yes, please, airlines are the only ones I know that try to squeeze more people into limited space (oh, and still increase the prices!) Please show respect for who your passengers are! They come in all shapes, sizes, colors and nationalities and do their best to get along while they travel-- they deserve to be accommodated to the best of "service" companies' abilities! You wouldn't charge extra for someone speaking Spanish or being Black, please don't discriminate against people of varying sizes! Thanks!

Posted By Bonnie on February 4, 2008, 2:45 PM

I have mixed feelings. I once sat next to an extremely overweight woman on a flight from Denver to Albuquerque. She poured over the edges of her seat, and actually had to sit on the armrests for the whole flight b/c she could not fit into the seat. I was in the middle seat and it was very uncomfortable for me but I did not say anything b/c I felt so badly for her. Now, if that had been an overnight or overseas flight ... I am not sure that I would have been so patient.

Posted By Sher on February 4, 2008, 2:45 PM

I'm 5 ft. tall and weigh 100 pounds. Luckily when I sit next to a heavy person it doesn't bother me. Most are very apologetic and I truly feel sorry for them. What bothers me is horribe body odor. That is offensive to me!

Posted By Carolyn W on February 4, 2008, 2:52 PM

The population is getting bigger, maybe the airlines shouldn't be making seating smaller but larger.

No one wants to be overweight and for those who are lucky enough to be thin, wonderful. Weight should not be a matter for the airlines or passangers.

Posted By Deb Wood on February 4, 2008, 2:53 PM

I think that a few rows of seats that will accommodate very large people is a must - for their health & comfort and that of their neighbours as well. Air travel is awful enough without being squished.

Yes, I would be upset if someone very large spilled over into my space. I think the airlines need to recognize the need for extra large seats in coach at a premium price, and insist that they only be filled by the largest people on the flight. This info. should be gathered during the seat assignment procedure. If a normal weight person wants to take up a large seat because they are travelling with an obese person, that should be permitted, with the extra cost being paid by the companion, not the airline.

Posted By donna on February 4, 2008, 2:55 PM

You really think a large person wants to be large? If they could they would be thin. It is a serious problem they face and people don't realize why a person ends up obese. Bad things happen to people and sometimes they end up eating to deal with the pain. It is so difficult! How dare you say how tired you are of accomodating a disabled person! Some people just require more help than others. It's called having compassion and caring about not only yourself but others.

The airlines want to put these tiny little uncomfortable seats all squished together to make the money. I realize they are in business to do so, but how about the customer, thin or large, who suffers for hours barely able to move stuck in their seat? Airlines need to get with the program and see that it's not fair to make their customers suffer. Americans are larger people and we need more space. Let's all insist this takes place now!

Posted By linnie on February 4, 2008, 3:01 PM

I was booked in the emergency exit row on a flight from SFO to DFW on American, when a 400+ lb man who needed a seatbelt extender squeezed into the seat next to me. I had to lean sideways as his bulk not only overflowed, but underflowed, the armrest between us. The plane was 100% full, so there was no option of changing seats. Putting aside the question of whether large people should purchase two seats (which is a resounding yes, in my book!), but what about the safety issues here? How is a man that large, who needs help from the flight attendants to get into the seat going to assist the deplaning of others in an emergency? When I brought my issue to American, they snubbed me. That was the last time I flew American. The only saving grace of the entire fiasco was the grace and understanding of the flight crew, who gave me one of their jump seats for the flight.

Posted By carol on February 4, 2008, 3:03 PM

I'm not a grossly obese person but overweight. The seats on airplanes are not comfortable and I do agree that they must have been reduced in size over the years...like everything else we pay for. I think the airlines should have a few seats that people over a certain weight can be assigned to and then if they are booked if that person wants that flight they should have to fly first class. In the event of standby, the airlines should just bump an obese standby person into first class. My skinny son flew in first class once because he was running late/didn't have ID and then found it...so surely the airlines could make others comfortable by putting them in first class at a last minute situation. I went to Lake Tahoe once and because I weighed over 200# I wasn't allowed to ride a horse due to the altitude/to protect the horse. They used an honor system, and I was honest and didn't ride. I can't imagine the airlines weighing people but sometimes we have to hear the hard questions.

Posted By Ellen on February 4, 2008, 3:03 PM

I feel sorry for the obese. I am sure they are not happy to be one. I think the airlines should reserve a special section for the obese, three seats for two.

Posted By Emmi on February 4, 2008, 3:04 PM

I agree with all the comments from the tall people. Being quite tall myself (6'1) I get really upset every time you get on a plane and there is a short person in either the bulkhead seats or the emergency exit row swinging their legs happily like a little kid. People need to have respect for the people in the plane with them, whether they are heavy or tall. Think about how much you would like to be shoved in a seat with half of you hanging over edge of an armrest or your knees jammed into the seat in front of you( and i mean extremely painfully jammed, the metal at the bottom of the seat is hard!). Short people stick to the regular seats and stop being so selfish! Save the bigger seats for bigger people!

Airlines need to wake up and realize that humans are getting bigger (taller and fatter!) and that they need to do something. I have found that Asian carriers, where people tend to be smaller, have the biggest seats. Why is it the American carriers that have the smallest seats?

Posted By Kristin Templin on February 4, 2008, 3:12 PM

An obese person should be considerate enough to purchase 2 seats or go 1st class.

Posted By Sandra on February 4, 2008, 3:13 PM

As the daughter of an obese person, I was curious to read this article. I'd hoped that since this is a travel magazine forum, and not Jerry Springer, there might be some enlightened discussion instead of the usual fat-bashing. Unfortunately, I was wrong.

My mom never flew anywhere until I was in my twenties. She was worried that she would inconvenience others and would be shamed by their looks and comments. when she did finally fly, it was only for my sake. She still prefers not to fly, so we've taken many road trips, but unfortunately, that limits where in the world we're able to travel. I would venture that my mom is far more considerate than the average-sized traveler. Like others above, she makes sure she gets an aisle and travels with me, so we can share the two seats we can afford and she doesn't leave her seat if it would inconvenience someone else. I wonder if all you skinny and superior people have ever considered the numbers of overweight people that do stay home (as you so kindly suggest) because they are terrified of being fat in public.

What bothers me is that we still, in this day and age, need a villian that we can blame all our problems on. These days the last acceptable discrimination is against fat folks. From the comments above it's hard to tell if we hate them because they have no self control and shove their faces full of food non-stop, or because they spill into our seats, or because they're smelly, or because they tax our health care system. Makes me wonder if eventually we'll have extra charges for people with chronic halitosis or body odor, or crying babies, or chattering kids, or ipods that I can hear through the headphones, or snorers, or the type-A workaholic that won't turn their light off and stop making phone calls even though it's the middle of the night. I wonder if eventually we'll all have to show our medical records to determine how much we "tax the system" so that we can pay our fair share if we tax it by being smokers, alcoholics, manic-depressives, or carnivores with heart problems. It's funny, in terms of taxing the medical system, the skinny athletes I know have recently needed the medical system more than my mom ever has. 5 Knee surgeries, 2 elbow surgeries, 2 foot surgeries and all the requisite hospital stays and physical therapy are what's been required by 3 athletic friends in just the last year. My mom hasn't needed the care of a doctor in several years, hmmm? Me thinks you folks that are worried about our health care system are just looking for nice sounding ways to justify your contempt and hatred toward fat people. Maybe if you spent a little more time asking why you should be kind to someone who is obviously suffering, instead of coming up with hollow justifications for your disdain, you'd be happier and the world would be a nicer, more compassionate place.

Since very few of you seem inclined toward compassion, I'll end this by telling you precisely why my mom is overweight. Then you decide if she should be barred from flying or made to feel like a disgusting criminal if she must. My mother's first memory is of being terrified of her mother. She was a baby boomer born to a too-young mother at a time when doctors were prescribing mom's caffeine pills and cigarettes as stress relievers. Grandma had 4 kids before she knew it and Grandpa was always away on some military assignment. Grandma's mom was dead and she had no family or support around. She didn't know what she was doing and at the time it was okay to beat your kids. My mom was terrorized everyday by her mother. She was hit over the head with a cast iron pan. She was whipped with a garden hose. She was made to stand in front of the house wearing a sign that said terrible things about her. She was in a constant state of fear. As a young child she started sneaking food into her room as a way of exercising some control over her chaotic situation. She was always terrified she'd be caught and get in even more trouble so she ate whatever she had fast. This is where her dysfunctional relationship with food began. She learned young to use food as her comfort. She also learned she was a bad person. That is, after all, what her mother told her everyday. After being sexually abused by her teenage brother and later her father, she was not a healthy individual. This was a lucky circumstance for my father. He was unhealthy himself and he really needed a young woman he could abuse to make him feel better about himself. Lucky for him, he found my mom who was already so conditioned to abuse, she didn't reject it when it came from him on a daily basis. Eventually, after trying to kill herself to end the misery, my mom realized she needed to pull it together since she was now a mom. She ended her relationship with my dad, and committed to being the best mom she could be. She ended the cycle of violence she had been steeped in and never once hit me. She found a way of living in the world that made it possible for her to survive, though not necessarily flourish. She always struggled with food. In large part it is because she was so conditioned to believe that she was bad as a young person that she used the food to comfort herself when the mental anguish was overwhelming. Of course, eating the food makes her feel bad about herself, which validates the original ideas my grandmother planted so long ago. This of course makes her miserable and since she is now terrified of people and finds it nearly impossible to trust anyone enough to have a relationship with, she is alone and miserable and the cycle repeats. Food has become her only comfort and yet it is also her jailer. As a child I remember strangers shouting fat cow at my mom in a parking lot or saying something under their breath as they walked past us at a restaurant. I remember all the kids at school teasing me for having a fat mom. I never could understand why people who didn't even know her would choose to go out of their way to hurt her when she had already suffered more hurt than any human should. The fact that she is alive is amazing. The fact that I am alive and never suffered any physical or emotional abuse is outstanding. My mom has had successes in her life but for her and so many people like her, food unfortunately, is the one source of comfort and yet it brings so much misery. Like my mom has said, fat people have it hardest; alcohol and drugs are not needed for survival so cold turkey and a life of abstinence is possible with those addictions. For the overeater, life is a cruel joke because they can never give up the food, they will simply be searching for a healthier relationship with it for the rest of their lives.

So, next time you see a fat person, do me a favor and ask yourself do I really need to add to this person's misery? Whether they are fat for a medical reason (glandular or medication side effects) or an emotional one, no fat person relishes being fat. It is far too painful a thing to be fat in this society, no one does it because they like it. Please open your heart and realize that almost every fat person you encounter is struggling with some form of pain and force yourself to be compassionate.

They are only now beginning to realize that binge eating is a psychological disorder like anorexia. This will bring comfort to all the folks who belittle themselves on a daily basis because they too believe they are bad people for not being able to control their relationship with food. I wonder what all the above commenters will feel when science does finally reveal that many overweight folks are incapable of reigning in their out of control eating habits. Will they finally have some empathy or compassion? After watching one person struggling with this torturous pain for a lifetime, all I can say is I hope so.

Posted By Chris on February 4, 2008, 3:15 PM

Let's face it, airline seats are getting smaller and people are getting bigger. Just like any industry that wants to survive, the airline industry must accommodate ALL of its customers. Suppose Toyota said, "We're only going to manufacture Prius cars?" It would seriously reduce its profitability, as for varying reasons a Prius doesn't address many of its customers' needs. There a lots of people who are large in different ways. If some guy is 6/6" and his knees are jabbing into the back of my seat, should he be shunned or shamed? No. Weight, size, etc., just as alchohlism and smoking have genetic orgins. However, people who drink too much, smoke, etc. have the luxury of stopping for a day and no one is the wiser as s/he sits down next to them on an airplane seat. An overweight person does not have the luxury of temporarily transforming himself in 24 hours. I, myself, have sat next to pipe smokers who wreak so pungently w/tobacco smoke that I have literally become ill. Nobody kicks them off the plane, or requires that they not carry tobacco products on them. I had people sit next to me who desperately needed to shower. Believe me, if an overweight person by just taking a shower, not carrying tobacco, or stop drinking for 24 hours so s/he could be a "normal size" person for his flight, s/he would. Stop blaming the individual and put the responsibility where it belongs, i.e, the airline industry. In an effort to maximize profitability, they have crammed us all like a bunch of sardines in a can. In the customer bill of rights currently under consideration, considered, it needs to state that all airline seats need to be 16-17 inches wide, and that there is a certain set aside of seats for tall/large passengers (possibly 5%). Additionally, it could show the same compassion for people accompanying young children or infirmed/elderly adults who may need some extra space. I am sure all of you have someone who you love that is large, ill or for some reason could have greatly benefit from some extra space on a plane. Do you really want her/him to be treated as less than human because s/he has different needs than you?

Posted By jacquelyn on February 4, 2008, 3:22 PM

Obese individuals should not be rewarded for their extra weight. Each seat has become very costly and if an obese individual needs more than one seat, he/she should pay for the xtra space and not take over some else's seating space or restrict the other guest room

Posted By Harold J Sherrington on February 4, 2008, 3:30 PM

I think the freight people charges by the amount something weighs, so I could see no problem with airlines doing the same thing. It is a chosen state that people are the size they are, so they should not have a problem paying for it. If you are over a certain size, first class, larger seat, no problem.

Posted By Herschel McMillan on February 4, 2008, 3:30 PM

About 10 yr. ago I took an 8-hr flight on Delta. Apparently the airline's policy at that time was to give a second, free seat to obese passengers. However, one fellow decided to give his second seat to a woman sitting next to me with a baby on her lap, then HE wedged in next to me. He complained because HE was uncomfortable, because he didn't have enough room to eat or relax. I just shut up and closed my eyes and hoped the time would pass quickly.

Posted By Susan on February 4, 2008, 3:34 PM

This subject has nothing to do with discrimination, however, it would be if business type seats were made available to overweight passengers at a non business class price - especially if everyone didn't have the ability to purchase the seats. The airlines have a certain sized seat, like a small shirt - if you can't fit, you have to buy a larger size (extra seat). Sad, but that's the reality of it.

Posted By Van on February 4, 2008, 3:40 PM

In response to all the people who have said the airlines need to make larger seats or better yet, make certain seats just for overweight people, hah!!

I am a flight attendant and deal with this issue very often on my flights. This isn't 1955 when travel by plane was for the most part done by wealthier people. It's 2008 and there are thousands more people able to travel today. And we didn't seem to have such an obesity problem in 1955!!!!

I am always put in an awkward position when a passenger tells me he is unhappy with his seat due to the large person sitting next to him. And usually they are telling me this in front of the large person!!! How would you respond to that??!!! Boeing or Airbus are not going to redesign their planes based on obese people. And if we did have special seats for obese people, I can only imagine the millions of complaints about that. Every single person on every aircraft wants a bigger seat!!!! And how do you determine what is obese?

In today's world when people do most of their transactions via computer, should there be a question of how much you weigh when booking your tickets? How many would be honest??? So you want to put it off on the gate agents, or the flight attendants? Completely unfair. It is so awkward addressing the matter to begin with. I wish I had an answer. The best I can ever come up with is this, "nobody said traveling was fun."

Posted By kris on February 4, 2008, 3:41 PM

Airline seats have become smaller and smaller over the years. I am a woman of normal size and find them too small. Shoulders are always rubbing someone else's. AIRLINES: do us a favor and give us all a few more inches (and a footrest)!

Posted By Jeanne on February 4, 2008, 3:42 PM

My problem is the same as others above.
I am overweight. I have purchased two seats before and I was forced, by the airline to give it up to someone else and was not refunded.

Another time the other person took it over with his stuff saying we were lucky to have an empty seat. I told him I had purchased it for me to be comfortable, he just laughed.

So, I will never spend that money again - it's just an unfair when others don't respect me when I'm trying to be respectful.

Posted By JSP on February 4, 2008, 3:44 PM

I'm 65 years old, played football in high school and college, and at 281 pounds, with a 42 inch waist, I'm overweight. But 18" (inside demension) seats on some airlines (SWA and othersw) fit fine. Delta, Air Tahitit (worst flight of my life, and I fly often) and others go for the 17" and 17 1/2" and two extra rows, so even my 6 foot height creates problems. These lines are just being cheap. Penny wise and pound foolish. If you're going to fly, just ask for the inside demension on the airline's seats. I don't fly Delta any more at all. dde

Posted By D Douglas Evans on February 4, 2008, 3:50 PM

Fat ain't "fair;" but it doesn't give me special complaining rights. One fact is obvious: the human skeleton accommodates added musculature, ligaments, organs--as well as fat--which can get in everyone's way.

Fasting two days a week, or even three, is not harmful and will actually increase our comfort on plane rides. Even those of us who credit "genetics" for our obesity can do the sensible thing and avoid the kind of intake that converts into fat, not muscle. We can also refuse airline meals!

Posted By Lucy on February 4, 2008, 3:50 PM

I too weigh only 90 lbs. & am 5 ft. tall as were 2 writers. I truly feel in the interest of safety, we must charge by total weight. We are now the most obese nation; the engineers need to factor this into physical factors for safety if the airplane and the passenger. I hate being next to a passenger who has paid for two seats and overflows into my seat on a commuter jet from Chicago to South Bend.(i.e. "our" one seat is being paid for 2x!!) I hate being squashed by someone, overweight or rude. I hate excess and huge cargo falling on me from dangerous overhead bins. I hate that the airlines allows excessively huge baggage into the cabin. I fly constantly and find these issues consistently being ignored by airlines.

Posted By Marjie Darling on February 4, 2008, 3:55 PM

I feel sorry for the obese,but they got themselves into that shape and others should not have to suffer for it.

Posted By Daneen L Gore on February 4, 2008, 3:57 PM

My husband is overweight, and when we fly he has difficulty putting on the seatbelet. Regardless if you believe that obesity is a choice or not, that is not the issue. The airlines have a duty to provide certain safety measures for all of their passengers, and these safety measures include seatbelts that fit adequately. It should be no shock to the airlines that people will be getting on the plane who are overweight.

Posted By A.C. on February 4, 2008, 4:00 PM

I don't think the woman who complained should have received anything in return. How dare her make a judgment call on someone else because of their outwardly appearance. Who you sit next to is the luck of the draw, bottom line. Airlines, if anything, need to make their seats wider to accomodate ALL passengers alike.

Posted By Faith Chakirian on February 4, 2008, 4:09 PM

Airlines use the amount of fuel required to maintain lift (counteract gravity) for the time and distance traveled. The heavier the plane, the more fuel used.

People above a body mass proportionate with their height should be charged a surcharge just as they would for oversized or overweight baggage. Otherwise, everyone else ends up paying more for someone else's personal indulgence.

I don't agree with arbitrarily classifying obesity as a handicap, except in the rare cases where it is caused by a physical medical ailment such as a glandular malfunction. People that make choices should shoulder their own burden of consequences. Why do some in our society think that people should not be accountable for their own actions?
...

Posted By J on February 4, 2008, 4:11 PM

I feel the situation should be addressed by the airlines. If it is not a full flight, the obese traveler should be seated next to an empty seat and not charged for the extra seat. If it is a full flight, that traveler should be charged the cost of the empty seat next to him/her. Another option would be for airlines to equip planes with so many larger seats for larger people, at a slightly higher ticket-price. Once those seats are filled, the traveler would have to opt for either 2 regular coach seats or a different flight that still had "premium" availability.
I too have been cramped into a coach seat next to a large person, and it is not pleasant, especially considering the cost of air travel today.

Posted By Merry Lee on February 4, 2008, 4:16 PM

With all due respect to the overweight person, if I pay for a seat I'm entitled to the full seat. If a person requires two seats they should pay for them. Next thing you know the ADA is going to step in and require airlines provide special seating for disabilities and guess who's going to pay for it.

Posted By James Wright on February 4, 2008, 4:16 PM

Airplanes should have a few seats that are larger and ailines should charge slightly more for these seats. They should only be available to large size people, but if a regular size person does wish to purchase these seats, they should be allowed to only at a price higher than the obese person is charger.

Posted By Kathie Vongroven on February 4, 2008, 4:43 PM

I do not feel sorry for an obese person that cannot fit into their own seat. Obviously, they know in advance that they will have a problem, but they do not take responsiblity. It is for the other passengers to cope or for the stewards to cope. Not fair!, obese people should own up to the situation and buy two seats or fly business class.

Posted By Michelle on February 4, 2008, 4:54 PM

1. The airlines are looking at the bottom line. More passengers mean more $$$$. Seats are not only getting narrower, the airlines are stealing 2 or 3 inches from the leg room, in order to get 1 more row of seats into that airplane. More seats mean more $$$.
2. If we are going to penalize the overweight person for making us uncomfortable, lets also penalize the thin person who insists on putting the seat back and lying in your lap.

Posted By Paula Pumphrey on February 4, 2008, 4:58 PM

I have an idea. How about if every plane had to have a seat custom-fit for every possible body type? That way they could cram seven anorexics in one row and two obese people in the next row. And people could be charged per pound of body weight! Of course, if you lost a couple of pounds by not eating on a long flight...you'd get a refund. But if you overindulged you'd have to pay an extra few bucks to get off the plane.

Clearly, I am kidding, but the truth is that I know of NOBODY who is 100% comfortable in an airplane seat. They seem to get narrower every year, and with less legroom to boot. With American getting fatter all the time and plane seats getting smaller, something has got to give. Even if everyone magically weighed some average amount like 140 (which will never happen), the airlines would suddenly decide that it was acceptable to strap us in in a standing position with our arms over our heads.

To the people who resent having a fat person taking up some of their space, I am willing to bet that you have inconvenienced others in your life. It's part of living in a community, people! We get stuck with people who we might not be crazy about! Sometimes they're fat, or smelly, or won't shut up, or drink too much and throw up in your lap. These things happen, and it's unfortunate, but your choices are to suck it up, or seal yourself off on your own private island. It's up to you.

Posted By Marie on February 4, 2008, 5:03 PM

If they want to charge by the pound or perhaps surcharge if you don't fit into the ever shrinking seats, then they need to give my little wife a discount for not taking up her alotted space. At 6'4" and 240 lbs it may come as a surprise to all the crowded little people that it is just as uncomfortable for the larger folks. If it is the weight the airlines are worried about, they need to weigh each passenger with their luggage to determine the rate. With a size 14 foot, I don't carry 4 pairs of shoes with me on a trip like my foot size 6 wife does. Airline seats are not like baseball caps . . . one size doesn't fit all. I've never had an airline seat that was safe for me to sit in. The headrest always hits me about an inch or two below the base of my skull. In the event of a crash, the person behind me will have my head sitting in their lap becuase it has snapped off because there was no head rest behind it. So rather than thinking of ways to penalize those folks who don't fit the mold, perhaps the airlines might look at ways to accommodate a variety of people that reflects the variations of people's body sizes.

Posted By Bill Barber on February 4, 2008, 5:09 PM

in the case of baggage, you are always expected to pay for excess weight. why can't you charge obese people extra for the extra weight? on vehicle ferries, toll roads, etc., size is a basis for fares, tolls, etc. so why can the airline not do the same, and have a section just for those obese people. they also need better ventilation, larger bathrooms, etc.

Posted By a r griffith on February 4, 2008, 5:13 PM

Boy, how cruel some of these posts have been!

No matter your opinion about people being fat or thin, think about where we go with this! So we want a fat person to buy an extra seat; what's next? How about charging a person for two seats who insists upon letting the seat back to the point where the person behind is unable to enjoy his meal? Or if someone gets sick on the plane and there's an unscheduled stop; should that person pay for the entire plane's hotel accomodations?

People of all shapes and sizes are CUSTOMERS, and when we support the airlines treating them as less than, we let them get away with not providing the services that we pay them for!

Posted By Mel on February 4, 2008, 5:26 PM

Regarding weight....why not lose some! If you ever traveled to Europe, one does not find "overweight" individuals, unless they are American tourists.

Posted By Bob on February 4, 2008, 5:28 PM

I do feel bad for the obese that I see when traveling, at the movies, or even restaurants where they have difficulty fitting in the seats. When purchasing a plane ticket, I feel like the fee I pay is for a particular portion of space (maybe 1/70th of the plane for example). I think if you exceed this "bought" space, whether it be with luggage or body, then you should pay for the additional space you will be using on the plane.

Posted By Leslie on February 4, 2008, 5:34 PM

I feel we should take responsibility for our actions. If we allow ourselves to become obese, we should take responsibility and pay for an extra seat, rather than inconveniencing our fellow passengers.

Posted By Lee on February 4, 2008, 5:35 PM

If we want to have socialism, let everyone make the same salary, live in equal quarters, use public transportation and have universal health care.
==
Unfortunately, we live in a society where everyone is supposed to pay their way. A person that weighs more costs more to transport all of those miles. They take up more space and people who sit next to them are cheated of the comfort they paid for. People should pay for the costs they cause as much as possible. I don't feel sorry for anyone. I pay for myself and I expect everyone else to do so, too.
==
That is how I feel until we really live in a nation that believes in the communist credo "From each according to his capability; to each according to his needs."

Posted By Lee on February 4, 2008, 5:35 PM

AT THE RATE THAT US AIRLINES AARE TRYING TO PUT IN MORE SEATS,THE DEFINITION OF OBEESE MAY HAVE TO BE REEVALUATED

Posted By george on February 4, 2008, 5:35 PM

I, as a normal sized person purchased a seat on an airline; therefore, I should get the entire seat. The person who is heavy needs to buy two seats, sit in first class or drive. If they pay for only one seat, what entitles them to 1 1/2, the 1/2 belonging to me?

Posted By Joan Zabor on February 4, 2008, 5:43 PM

I, as a normal sized person purchased a seat on an airline; therefore, I should get the entire seat. The person who is heavy needs to buy two seats, sit in first class or drive. If they pay for only one seat, what entitles them to 1 1/2, the 1/2 belonging to me?

Posted By Joan Zabor on February 4, 2008, 5:45 PM

I have been on flights where I was seated next to someone infringing on my space making the flight very uncomfortable for me. I feel that I paid for a full seat. I don't really care who takes the responsibility; the obese person or the Airline, but my space should be protected. I have also had people sitting behind me ask that I not recline my seat because they are tall and don't have enough leg room. I have a problem with someone asking me to sit upright on a 10 hour flight to Europe!

Posted By Barry on February 4, 2008, 5:53 PM

Just because a person doesn't know when to stop eating, they should not be given special accommodations. They need to purchase a double seat just like the parents of small children should purchase a seat for their children. We should not have to accommodate persons who choose a different life style. Obesity is preventable . It costs us all in higher medical insurance and it should not be rewarded with special privileges. If someone is really handicapped there need to be special attention but obesity is not a handicap. I was smashed next to a large man on one flight. Thanks goodness he was a delight and smelled good and it was a short flight. I AM A REGISTERED NURSE AND WE HAVE NURSES INJURED EVERY DAY TRYING TO PUSH AND PULL THESE HUGE PEOPLE. I feel for them but they have to adapt a healthy life style. My step daughter just lost 100 lbs on Weight watchers. They need to get help.

Posted By Carol on February 4, 2008, 6:03 PM

Wow...a lot of people are weighing in on this -- haha (pun intended).

Anyway, I think when you buy a ticket, it's the airline's responsibility to carry you from point A to point B. Fact is that the airlines put seats on these airplanes that are too small even for average sized people.

I think they need to widen the seats some to accommodate everyone. If it means taking out seats, and having to raise fares some then so be it. They try to cram too many people onto a plane as it is.

Posted By Mark on February 4, 2008, 6:11 PM

Seems to be a general concensus, as I read the contributions: Pay by weight. But we already have a system that can incorporate that. It is by encouraging (require) overweight individuals to purchase first class...seats are larger and often set apart.

Posted By Arthur L Kontio on February 4, 2008, 6:11 PM

Some of the comments suggest that the airlines are shrinking their seats in an effort to feed their greed. It is true that some airlines have, over the years, reduced the space between the rows to get an extra row. It is NOT factual that they are reducing the width of the seats. Some aircraft have been flying for decades with the same number of seats per row. I suspect that some people complaning about shrinking seats also complain that their size 10 dresses or 36 inch pants don't fit at all as well! I suggest we can resolve the obese flying problems by one or more of these actions:
1. Eat less
2. Move more
3. Buy 2 seats
4. Go 1st class

Posted By Monte H on February 4, 2008, 6:18 PM

There is much anger voiced against the obese that could be better directed toward suggestions for redesigning airline seating. Unfortunately we are a growing society with average weights climbing yearly. A new, fresh approach is needed for airline seating. What about an egg-shaped cocoon seat that would make it impossible to invade neighbors space yet would accommodate most travelers, thin and obese. That with a multi-size bench seat reserved for non-fit emergency seating would be welcomed by most. It could be available for a cost premium and limited to flyers who qualify due to their need for additional seating space in the plane.

Posted By Janet on February 4, 2008, 6:21 PM

I think the airline ticketing should be fair. And since now the energy price has gone way up and we know heavier objects requiring more fuel to lift. plus the fairness for all the fellow passengers who do not need to take up more than one-seat space. It is only fair to create bigger seats with higher costs for anyone who needs or wants that.

Posted By Mel Harrison on February 4, 2008, 6:46 PM

I believe that obese people should have to pay for the extra seat they take up. Just as smokers should not be allowed to smoke in public places. People who refuse to take control of themselves should not inconvenience those who do. I am an ex-smoker and ex-obese person. I never believed I had the right to inconvenience or hurt others before I took control of myself and quit smoking and lost that unhealthy extra fat. We all should be responsible for ALL our own actions and addictions. Period.

Posted By Irene on February 4, 2008, 6:48 PM

Well-I used to be on the thin side and due to medical problems - and depression came along with the medical problems I have put on 100 pounds. I am not happy with it and the airplane seats are most definetely not what they used to be - my point is that all people that are "obese" did not get that way just by overeating. Sometimes there are a lot of other reasons/problems for this - so please - be kind when you think that we/they are just fat and can lose weight if we want to. :)
I can fit into a regular seat with no room to spare but I am extremely careful to stay on my side.

Posted By Sheri Tolleson on February 4, 2008, 6:52 PM

Make 'em pay for two seats! It's not the neighboring passengers fault that these people are obese! On a transatlantic trip once, I had to sit next to a smelly, disgusting, overweight woman, who never stopped eating food she brought with her the whole 10 hour trip to California. In addition the airline (KLM) had permitted her to bring too many large carry ons which took up all her leg room. What a mess!

Posted By Fred Welch on February 4, 2008, 6:55 PM

Well, having seen both sides now (used to be thin and the seats were bigger then, now am, er, pleasingly plump and the seats are smaller too), I think the problem is that one-size-fits-all fits practically no one. I also am tall, as well as wide, and over the years, airplane seating seems to have shrunk knees-to-tailbone and side-to-side, both. Now, the side-to-side might be my perception problem since I am indeed heavier than I used to be, but I am no taller than I used to be, and these days, my knees are absolutely jammed against the seat in front of me (BEFORE the passenger in front of me reclines the seat and ends up laying in my lap). I'm not even 6 feet tall; I pity those that are that tall -- and these days, what with our improved nutrition and health care etc etc., we seem to be turning out more 6 footers (male and female) all the time.

And, on the issue of side-to-side, even if the armrests are raised to make more hip room, normal sized adults (especially males, who tend to be broader at the shoulder) still have to sit at a slight angle because there isn't room for all three sets of shoulders to fit even when tucked right against each other. And, the person in the middle of a 3-seat is plain out of luck, period, if he/she wants an armrest -- true whether the passengers are fat or thin.

Bottom line, airline seating is way too skimpy for perhaps 85% of the population. If only 15% of the flyers were "overlapping", that might militate for having 15% of the seats sold be larger and available ONLY to those folks within the 15% -- but whaddaya want to bet that even those who are shorter and skinnier would clamour "unfair" and want them, too?

As long as airlines offer public accommodation, they should be required to accommodate all members of the public, no matter what their height and width, at no extra charge. Maybe it's time to re-evaluate what constitutes reasonable seating, and do some retooling? Or -- leave the seating "as is" until the next time planes are retired or revamped, but only sell window and aisle seats (no middle seats) until the retooling is done?

On big planes, which tend to be the ones that fly intercontinental routes/international routes (and thus have longer flights), the middle seating is guaranteed torture if you're an adult with normal levels of aches and pains, even if you weigh only 90 lbs.

Maybe instead of charging extra for first class seating, all seats should pay the same, but those more than x inches high and/or xx inches wide and/or xxx lbs would have the option of identifying themselves as such and getting first dibs on those seats? Being taller than 5-2 or heavier than 120 lbs isn't necessarily a disability, but I tell you what, fat or not, with the cramped seating currently available for everyone, after a 4 or 5 hour transcontinental air trip, you WILL be disabled by the time you try to stand up and hobble off the airplane.

Posted By Tikker on February 4, 2008, 7:37 PM

What I see happening in this matter is:
The airlines charging the obese people more money,
and not changing the seating
accomodations. That will still leave everyone unhappy.
Do you really think the airlines is going to change all the seats for obese people, when they don't even
have handicapped accomodations?
Treat people like they were a guest in your home and not someone in your way!

Posted By Dixie on February 4, 2008, 7:43 PM

I feel that airlines shoul sell tickets that entitle the purchaser to X number of pounds. The pounds are a sum of body weight and luggage wait. If I arrive with less than the limit, I can sell my extra pounds to a passenger who arrives with pounds over the limit. If there are not pounds to buy, you would not fly being over the limit.

Posted By G Mason Jahr on February 4, 2008, 7:57 PM

I'm a large person and twice in the past have paid for two seats so I wouldn’t inconvenience anyone. Both times the other person in my row was traveling with a small child and used the other seat I paid for. I explained nicely I paid for the second seat and was ignored. When I brought it to the attention of a flight attendant, I was again ignored. After both flights, I contacted the airlines and nothing was done. In short, I paid for seats for someone else's child to use. Needless to say, I won’t be purchasing two seats again.

Posted By Robin on February 4, 2008, 7:59 PM

First, I'm appalled at the number of obese/disabled people talking about sitting in the emergency exit aisles because of the increased space! Second, I think a lot of the alleged discrimination against the obese is frustration on the part of other travelers, eg "I have heavy friends, but they don't sit on me" coming out as anger. It was just announced today that UAL will charge for a second checked bag. Why should I pay for that when two suitcases and I are less weighty then some passengers?

Posted By christy on February 4, 2008, 8:05 PM

It is the obese person's fault that he/she is obese, even if there are medical issues. Deal with them. Airlines should charge obese people extra, like they do for overweight luggage, and honor the second seat the obese person purchases. If the obese person cannot afford a second, then he/she needs to eat less to save for the cost of a second seat, and perhaps lose enough to not need one. Measurements should apply to passengers like they do to carry on luggage.

Posted By E Hall on February 4, 2008, 8:07 PM

This blog is just mean-spirited. When did it become a crime to be overweight? Plus, there are more people in my category (240 lbs.) than in the mean seats!

Posted By Pam Autio on February 4, 2008, 8:08 PM

First off, lets admit that nobody is comfortable on a plane these days, for one reason or another. My 4'11", 130 lb mom's legs can't reach the floor, so the circulation is cut off to the backs of her dangling legs unless she puts her feet on something... then of course she is obstructing the area between the seats. We all know the miniscule seats and nonexistent legroom is all about cramming more people in the same amount of space, so let's look at this mathematically.
Take a 757-200 (most models) - ignoring any odd 4 seat exit row or extra lav configurations, most of them have 27 rows of ABC DEF seating in coach.
That comes out to 162 seats with an average pitch of 31" (pitch gives you an approximation of leg room) and average seat width of 17.2" (heck, my kitchen chairs are 18.5" wide!).
If the airlines removed 2 rows (=12 seats) they would add nearly 2.5" of pitch to the remaining 25 rows.
If the airlines removed 1 seat from each of the remaining rows (=25 seats) they would add 2.8" inches to each of the other seats and the aisle (which is always tight... elbow smacked by a drink cart anyone?) making a width of 20" per seat - nearly 1st class standards!
OK so here comes the money impact: 37 seats removed from coach, at say $500 a ticket = $18,500 in lost revenue. Divide $18,500 by the remaining 125 seats, that's an addition of $148 per ticket, coming out to $648. They should be able to offset some of that with the reduced fuel cost because of reduced payload, but they won't.
Also take into consideration lost revenue for the time the aircraft is out of service for the retrofit, they will charge extra for that too. Though every plane has to go in for a major mechanical check every year or couple of years, I think they should do the retrofit then, they won't lose anymore (or not much more) time in service because the swap out whole floor panels... the change should be fairly quick.
This would make more room for everyone in coach, and should eliminate a lot of discomfort. For the extra space and comfort, I would definitely pay $648 instead of $500 (or $324 instead of $250, etc), but many people can't afford the extra.

Posted By Monica on February 4, 2008, 8:11 PM

What's next, a law mandating that oversized clothing for oversized people cost no more than clothing for the rest of us?

Posted By Ted on February 4, 2008, 8:26 PM

Seriously - is this REALLY a question? OBVIOUSLY, the burden is on the obese person who does not CARE enough to do something about it. Believe me, I KNOW what I am talking about - I used to weigh 316 lbs. [I am 5'4"], and WHEN I got sick & tired of that, I lost 146 lbs. in 11 months. You WANT to weigh that much [TRUST ME-I NEVER accidently ate something I didn't willingly put in my mouth] then YOU need to pay extra for something so far out of the norm no one should have to suffer because of YOUR lack of self-control!

Posted By Hank Hollman on February 4, 2008, 8:40 PM

You're mostly all mean.

I hope none of you ever get fat. I hope none of you ever suffer with depression. I hope none of you ever get a medical condition that requires you to take medication that makes you fat. I hope none of your parents or children become fat or disabled. I hope you never find yourself in a situation where your circumstance, or that of a loved one, might inconvenience someone else. I hope this doesn't ever happen to you because I've lived with it my whole life and it's no fun. In fact, it sucks because most people are like you all, mean.

The funny thing is as I write that I hope it doesn't happen to you, I know that it will. Something will happen to you, or a family member, or a friend that will be difficult, and painful, and out of your control. You will find yourself at the mercy of other people's kindness one day. I hope, for your sake, that when you do find yourself in need of some kindness that the person you meet is me and not you. I hope this for your sake because I know I will be a nice person. I know what it is to suffer the pain of not being a perfect person, therefore I have what's called empathy. Unfortunately, you have no empathy and the longer you get to live your smug, perfect, life, the harder that fall will be when it does eventually happen.

Good luck and here's hoping the Golden Rule will eventually matter in your life.

Posted By Chris on February 4, 2008, 9:19 PM

This is a no brainer. If you take up two seats, pay for them. I don't pay for a seat so I can sit on anyone's lap or be pushed out into the aisle. I can't help it that the seats are narrow, and the hips are wide. It isn't discrimination it is just the facts.

Posted By Adele Burke on February 4, 2008, 9:33 PM

We all hate being imposed upon by others without regard to our needs. I don't like being squeezed by large people, but I tolerate it like I tolerate screaming babies and the criminally perfumed. Flying these days is an exercise in learning to tolerate much.

Fact is, most of us have some physical attribute that makes our lives difficult at times. I happen to have very long legs. I didn't choose to have them, they just grew that way. When the person in front of me reclines his/her seat, more often than not I become very uncomfortable. Yet many people consider it a god-given right to recline, no matter how uncomfortable that makes others. I hope all those who complain here about inconsiderate seat mates take the time to consider the person behind you before you recline your seat.

Maybe it's time for some re-regulation of the industry regarding basic human needs of passengers, including the size and spacing of seats. In the meantime, sites like SeatGuru.com can give you good information about which airlines provide some comfort for passengers and which don't.

Vote with your dollars. I almost booked a flight recently on USAir until I found out how puny their seat pitch is. I booked instead on Frontier and enjoyed a comfortable flight.

Posted By Jeff on February 4, 2008, 9:33 PM

Wow! I know this is controvercial, but I am suprised at the comments by many of you. Obesity is a disease that some people can't control. I understand many of you think it is only the undisciplined who can't put down the fork, but it isn't that cut and dry. There are many contributing factors and to throw everyone into your narrow-minded catagories is just that, narrow-minded!

If one were to look at the weight and balance information the airlines and pilots do before takeoff, it would be much more startling. As a pilot, I use 150 lbs (the industry standard taught to pilots in flight school) for each passenger when I do my calculations. I KNOW this doesn't apply to very many adults these days, myself included. The reasoning behind that is that kids don't weigh that much so the overweight adults and children balance out. Only, I don't think that is happening much these days either with childhood obesity being an epidemic. The issue here comes in play with gross weight of the passengers, bags, and fuel. What happens when the pilots figure this out but don't have the children to balance it out? You are now over gross weight and your aircraft handling suffers. Maybe even to the point of possible catastrophic failures if it is severely off.

I think the airlines should take into account their figures are quite old and reconfigure the aircraft seating to give more room for the currently average adult. (Which isn't 5'6" and 150 lbs.) Maybe even have larger, "special needs" seats that can be reserved ahead of time on a first come, first served basis when reservations are made. I understand this will send up the cost of flying per individual, but we would all be more comfortable and the battle of sharing your seat with a somewhat overweight passenger would be occuring less frequently.

Posted By Kathy on February 4, 2008, 10:16 PM

You know, I tried to get two seats on a trip back from Vegas on United. I had purchased THREE seats, one for me, one for my thin mother, and one for my husband. My husband was required to travel overseas and had to leave from Vegas, so since we ALREADY paid for his seat, when I got to the counter, I asked that no one be assigned my husband's seat because I didn't want to be squished or squish a stranger (it's ok to squeeze next to my husband)The stupid idiot at the counter advised me the flight was overbooked and they didn't care if my we already paid for three seats they were going to put someone else in the seat whether or not I liked it or was uncomfortable. I was so mad the entire way because they made darn sure they put someone in a seat I bought. Then I asked for a refund and was refused. The reason, was my husband bought the seat so I wasn't entitled to it. I WILL NEVER FLY A UNITED AGAIN. So see, it doesn't matter what you do, these airlines are going to ignore you so they can cram in more people. We are nothing but cattle to them. To those who think this is a "choice" I am a fat person and I had surgery to help me correct this. I am after a year still have weight to lose, but I have successfully lost 105 lbs so far. Even with surgery, I have to diet and not eat food that will cause me to gain weight or be sick. You people who declare, it's all the obese person's fault because they stuffed their fat faces, simply have little understanding of obesity. It isn't simply a physical disease it's also involves many psycological issues as well. I got fat because I starved myself, then stuffed myself, then staved myself. Our food supply is over run with hormones, corn syrup, and fat. Is it any wonder America's butt cheeks are always growing when it's ok to sell food injected with bovine growth hormone? Is it any wonder we are turing into friggin cows? Heck, I can't even get anything to eat at an airport, it's all fast food, junk food or calorie rich coffees and ice cream. I bring my own if so I am not forced to eat crap. Oh, but it's all our fault. It's not the big corporations who feed the fatted calves then make millions selling us diet plans? I am so sick of people judging me. I am tying soooo hard to lose this weight and I hate ever having to encroach on someone else's seat. I would gladly pay for another seat but as you can see above, even when you pay for it, airlines can screw you and me over. Remember we are cattle and we don't count anymore. As long as flights are over booked, and they try to cram even average sized people into tiny seats, then this problem will not be solved. They need to make seats bigger because EVERYONE deserves to be safe and comfortable.

Posted By Jacquie on February 4, 2008, 10:24 PM

I don't want to be cruel to people of size, I know they struggle with many issues, from ridicule and humiliation to outright discrimination. But having said that, when I pay for a seat on a flight, I should be entitled to just that - one seat. Not a seat that's partially occupied by someone else, which is to a large degree a safety hazard.

As a paying customer, the airlines have an obligation to make my safety and comfort just as much of a priority. I don't know what the solution is - asking people of size to pay more for taking up more room may not seem politically correct, but it isn't unfair.

The airlines could also seek to accommodate people of size by allocating a section of larger seats on part of the aircraft for these passengers, like they did in the past when they had designated smoking areas.

But the bottom line is that this is the airlines' issue to solve - it shouldn't be up to the paying customers to sacrifice safety and comfort, regarless of their size, so the airlines can continue ignoring the issue.

Posted By AnnieKN on February 4, 2008, 10:52 PM

If a person connot fit into a seat and must take over the next person's as well they should pay for 2 seats. I was once over 300 pounds and took the aisle seat or didn't fly. I did'nt come close to using part of another persons seat but I surely would not have had the nerve to inconvienence 2 other people paying the same fair as me. On one trip to LA a couple years ago (after I had Lost over 100 lbs) a 500 pound 6'6" man stepped over me at the last second and sat next to the window. I had to lean out into the aisle and he was still sitting right on top of me. My back hurt for over a week! Make people pay for the space they use!

Posted By Shawn Weaver on February 4, 2008, 10:59 PM

At the boarding gate there is a luggage rack in which carry ons are supposed to fit. The airlines don't enforce that, so how do you hope that they enforce rules for overweight individuals? I am overweight and so is my wife. When we fly in a plane that has the 2-4-2 configuration, we opt for the side with the 2 seats together. We may not be comfortable, but we are uncomfortable together and not bothering anyone. When we go on a flight over 1-1/2 hrs. long, on a 3-3 configuration, we will purchase 3 seats together. We have flown in the states and overseas and have never had any problems retaining our 3 seats. I do notify the agent that we are 2 flying with 3 purchased seats together. The gate agent is also notified when we get to the gate, and as we enter the plane, the individual greating us is notified. By notifying the above mentioned individuals, we have never had anyone place in our extra seat. I'm handicaped, so when we fly Southwest we preboard and notify the attendants of our 3 seat purchase. In a situation like this, one must be polite, but forceful to maintain what was purchased. We are not rich, as we are on a fixed income. We plan ahead so we will have the funds to purchase the 3 seats in order to be more comfortable and not to infringe on others. It is easy to complain about a situation you are in, but only you as an overweight person can do something about it. We have chosen to do something!

Posted By Manny on February 4, 2008, 11:01 PM

Ha, for all of you complaining that fat people tax the health care system, check it out (http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/22995659/)

It turns out healthy skinny people cost the health care system more than obese folks or even smokers!

Boy, I can't wait to see the anti-skinny comments start flying after this info gets out.

Posted By Pat on February 4, 2008, 11:02 PM

First, be aware that the airlines have cut the number of their flights to make money and make sure every plane is filled to capacity.

Next, they have downsized the seats in economy class to get more people in one plane, and to make you consider economy plus, or the new reduced price business class seats.

On top of everything else, the don't feed anyone in economy domestic. What will go next?--the restrooms.

It is not the fault of large passengers for causing less space for smaller passengers. Most of the present economy seats were made for no one larger than a normal teenager--especially if your tray table is in the arm of your seat and not on the back of the seat in front of you.

THE OBLIGATIONS RESTS SQUARELY ON THE AIRLINE TO PROVIDE SEATS THAT FIT MOST AMERICAN ADULTS. God knows, we are paying enough for the seats and getting nothing else in return except the trip and lots of inconvenience.

The Rev. Ronald J. Lynch

Posted By Ronald J. Lynch on February 4, 2008, 11:11 PM

If a passenger is so overweight that they require more space than the normal allotment, then they should pay for it. When you ship anything airmail, you pay by weight and package size. What's the difference?

Posted By Tom Martin on February 4, 2008, 11:23 PM

Actually,it isn't really fair for obese people to take up other seats that other paying customers have paid for,so the airline industry ought to either manufacture seats that are big enough to accomodate obese people or they should not allow people over a certain weight to even fly.Either way,you won't really have this problem of seating and whether or not someone pays for it.Really i don't think that its right for an obese person to have to pay extra because its not like its an easy thing to lose weight and anyway the airlines don't offer proper large seats for the obese like i said so it wouldn't be right to charge them extra.And likewise the airlines should not be responsible for people allowing themselves to become obese.Unless they are prepared to offer extra large seating for them.If the airlines can't accomodate proper seating for the obese then they shouldn't expect the obese to pay extra for it.Plain and simple.Also it couldn't hurt for the obese to lose a little weight too.

Posted By Lori on February 4, 2008, 11:41 PM

Compassion, people.
We ALL have basic human rights. Now let's try being humane to one another!
There are several viable solutions to this dilemma but, judgement & condemnation are NEVER in the equations!

Posted By Kimberly on February 5, 2008, 12:57 AM

Airlines are at fault, as is the US food industry, and of course, us for eating too much and exercising too little.
I weigh 265, but only take up 1 seat below the
armrest. Above is another matter.

Airlines should provide 3 grades of seats on US flights.
Good airlines, such as Cathay Pacific, do provide 3 or 4 classes on intercontinental flights.

Large people should be allocated the slightly larger seats at a slightly higher price. Perhaps 20% more space for 20% higher price.
With seat width usually only 17-17.5" on smaller aircraft many people cannot fit in a normal seat.
American Airline's and SAS fly identical Airbus 330's but AA has 17" seats with a 31 pitch. SAS has 3 classes in the same aircraft with 35 seats having 18.3" and 37 pitch and even their smallest seat is 17.7" with a 32 pitch.

Remember that Americans want CHEAP air travel, but that the airlines can, and should, give passengers more choices.

Posted By Rich on February 5, 2008, 1:07 AM

I see an opportunity here. Someone needs to design and market "your personal seat space".

Sort of a foldable divider that you can slip between seats. That way we can all have our space divided up perfectly, nice and easy! No spreading fat, no splayed legs, no armrest wars.

Maybe there can even be zip-up tent attachments to keep out smelly colognes, and noise made by crying babies and electronic devices.

Good, problem solved. Now you can all go back to ranting about why handicapped people get all the good parking places.

Posted By Laura on February 5, 2008, 1:50 AM

Airlines are selling "airfare"; they're selling passage from one place to another.

No one should be uncomfortable. Thin people shouldn't have to "share" their space. Fat people shouldn't have to pay more to get to the same destination. People shouldn't be bumped because the airlines overbook every flight. And there should ALWAYS be at least one extra seat on every flight.

Yes, seats used to be wider, but I don't them changing anytime soon. Passenger trains are pretty roomy if you've got the time.

Posted By Bobby on February 5, 2008, 2:32 AM

Ask the Airlines to comment. They are the ones with the skinny width seats, even for a normal weight person. Notice the heavy response to this issue. Many of my friends rather drive than fly. I must fly overseas 3X a year, so have no choice, but I quit flying Flugstanza because of their skinny seats; KLM and American are better. Airlines should accommodate their customers, not the other way around.

Posted By Don on February 5, 2008, 3:22 AM

I see drug abuse and obelity as similar. Both can be deemed addiction disabilities. We have laws against people driving cars while on drugs; we allow employers to not hire potential employees who test positive for drugs; maybe airlines and trains should be allowed to sell specific seat spaces - specifying the exact size of a seat space - and people who do no fit into the space would have to make other arrangements. I have had the experience of being forced out of my seat by a person who did not fit into theirs; no one should be deprived of comfortable use of a seat for which he or she has paid.

Posted By ernst hall on February 5, 2008, 5:00 AM

If you take up two seats you should pay for two seats.

Posted By Scott on February 5, 2008, 6:00 AM

First, I would like to say that those who think anyone can just "lose the weight" if they want to obviously has not had a weight problem. While I don't take up more than 1 seat, I do understand that extreme difficulty in losing weight. After reading the comments about what happened when people tried to do what was right and bought an extra seat, I can't blame them for not doing that. Heavy people have no more $$ than thin people. I do think the airlines should make all of their seating a little roomier. When I am on a long flight, I always feel cramped, as do my thin daughters.

Posted By Sue on February 5, 2008, 7:00 AM

I agree with Chris "This is a no brainer. If you take up two seats, pay for them. I don't pay for a seat so I can sit on anyone's lap or be pushed out into the aisle. I can't help it that the seats are narrow, and the hips are wide. It isn't discrimination it is just the facts." Amen, very well said. And yes, I have experienced first hand an obese person taking up her seat & mine for a rather long flight.

Posted By Sue on February 5, 2008, 8:10 AM

The recent strict luggage restrictions where each passenger pays for an overweight suitcase should also apply to passengers. Airlines should consider larger seats for overweight persons and charge more for them. Afterall, the way I understand the surcharge for heavier luggage is because more weight requires more fuel - this should apply to body weight as well. It just might make more obese people fly, I'm sure they feel uncomfortable themselves.

Posted By DORIT on February 5, 2008, 8:53 AM

What about the people who are not obese but who have really wide shoulders? I constantly end up by some man who takes up a good portion of my seat because he has wide shoulders. I end up sitting twisted and my back hurts. If people who spill out of their seats have to pay for another, then those people need to as well.

Posted By Nina on February 5, 2008, 9:17 AM

The cause of this problem is not fat people or tall people or inconsiderate people or nasty people or greedy people. The cause is that airlines have chosen one size fits all as the model for sizing their accomodations. This is certainly simpler and economical, but ignores reality. People are different sizes, with distributions including small, average, big-wide, big-tall, and big-big.

Presently, airlines choose to use the smallest area possible for coach seats, even if it means that a significant percentage of the traveling customers are severely inconvenienced and almost everyone must tolerate moderate inconvenience. The old days of 90% being comfortable and high prices for all have disappeared. They could return, but the cost per seat would resemble first class pricing for everyone.

The only solution that would allow adequate seating for all and economically feasible fares would require five sizes of seats: Small passenger, average, tall, wide, and tall-wide. The consequences would be both higher prices on average, as the total seating would be fewer seats per flight, and determining who sits where. Then, what happens when Tall is overbooked but Small has extra seats? Will there be people-sizers to sort us into our mandated size class, with a surcharge for unplanned use of a big seat? Will airlines be forced to offer a voucher rebate to encourage overbooked talls to squeeze into an average seat. My eyes glaze over.

American Airlines had longer coach seat pitch ("More Room in Coach") but people chose cheaper airlines without them. So American ripped them out and went back to cram 'em in to stay in business.

Will you pay more for an average seat in a plane with multi-size seating?

Posted By A. J. Peabody on February 5, 2008, 9:27 AM

I think the easiest solution would be to have larger seats overall - but I don't see that happening because it would cut into the airlines' profits. Maybe having SOME larger seats (at a slightly higher cost) would help, but probably would not accommodate all of the passengers who need them.

I too have been in the situation of sitting next to an obese woman who took up about a third of my already-uncomfortable center seat. Luckily, I'm small, so while it was an inconvenience for me, I felt really sorry for this woman, who was spilling over and under the armrest on my side. It must have been a painful experience for her.

As a petite person, I too find airline seats uncomfortable because they are too high if I am not wearing heels. Of course I don't blame the airlines for this; I just prop my feet on my carry-on bag under the seat in front of me. However, the difference here is that only I am inconvenienced.

Posted By Pam on February 5, 2008, 9:29 AM

I think both parties have some responsibility. If someone is significantly over wieght then they should have to either fly first class or purchase two seats. If the airlines does not enforce this requirement then thye should be obligated to compensate the person or persons who's seats were encroached upoin by this individual. I realize it is a tough sitaution for the airlines to try and set the standards for what constitutes obese. I think they need to start having a statement pop up on line that defines obese and tells the person that if they fit into that category they need to purchase another seat or an upgrade seat. If they don't the airline can refuse them a seat at check in. Not a pleasant thing to have to do but I beleive it is necessary.

Posted By Phill Orth on February 5, 2008, 9:47 AM

As an obese person, I can tell you that it's there is no winning situation. I never felt bad that I had to be cramped into a seat and be uncomfortable. After all it was my life choices that made me this way and I'm the one who chose to fly.

Having said that, I always feel bad for the person that gets stuck next to me, almost everyone trys to be nice and pretend it doesn't bother them but of course it does, it would me.

Here's the quandry. If I don't buy an extra seat, theres a chance the plane won't be full or that a small person sits next to me (your pray about this).

If you do buy an extra seat and plane if full, people get excited because they see an open seat only to receive a hateful look when they either realize the seat has a RSVP in it or even worse, you have to explain the to the other person WHY they can't sit there. It's a no win.

It's already embarrassing enough that you have to walk sideways down the isle, ask someone to sit with them, ask for a seat belt extension.

It's our society that's all to eager to help make us fat but then are shocked and unaccomodating when we are. The airlines should stop trying to make seats for supermodel passengers and start making them for real people to sit in and if an accomodation does need to be paid for (free or paid for), to do it with tact and grace. I've had to ask for a seat belt extention 3 times once before I actually got and I've had the flight attendant have other passengers pass it back to me for the world to see. Or announce over the intercomm "will the person needing the seat belt extension please raise their hand". Once, I bought an extra seat ticket and they made me get a doctors note with my weight on it in order to "allow me to buy an extra seat".

Again, it's not a black and white issue and certainly the obese person bears the overall burden of responsiblity, I'm just saying come up with a more consistent and discrete method.

I'm happy to report I've lost over 100 pounds and flying is a breeze now, but I sure feel sorry every severerly obese person I see walk on. You can come sit by me, we'll suffer together and I won't make you feel bad :)

Posted By David Guy on February 5, 2008, 11:21 AM

It's not so much the overweight person taking half your seat; it's every seat is a half seat. Twiggy and her best friend might be comfortable next to each other, but for the most part all airline seats are tight. Live with it for a few hours, or take a boat.

Posted By Gary Nations on February 5, 2008, 11:47 AM

Obese people just happen when I travel, and I just put up with that. Likely, they can't help it. Likewise, 200 lb+ men just happen, and they can't help it either. Perhaps if they just sat knees together, like any proper lady is taught to do ... If you are a traveling woman, you know what I am talking about. If you are a gent, think a sec - Thamks !
Anne

Posted By Anne on February 5, 2008, 12:02 PM

As reasonably free people, we need to assume responsibility for ourselves and our actions. Until, and it may be never, the airlines come up with a solution, it is my opinion that obese people and those with small children should purchase an extra seat.

My son and daughter-in-law purchase a seat in coach for their small son for just this reason.They are fortunate that he does not cry and disturb others on the flight.

Reviewing the literature in the field, it appears that few obese people are obese for reasons other than their own actions, no matter how we might wish it were otherwise.

Do I think this will become the standard without legislation or hard choices on the part of airlines? No indeed, but we can wish. No one says they have to upgrade to 1st class, but purchasing another coach seat at regular price is a very workable situation. Maybe obese people would travel a little less, maybe not, but it is very cost effective. Airlines should not have the ability to commandeer these seats at will.

Posted By Suzie on February 5, 2008, 12:52 PM

Having recently flown to Hawaii sandwiched between my husband and a body builder, I would like to address the issue of space. The airlines have made the choice to downsize seating at a time that people are bigger than ever. I do, however, believe in personal responsibility. I do believe that the airlines have the right to charge more for accomodating a larger passenger. I would like to see them make all of us more comfortable and, if they choose to fit obese people into seating that is too small, at least try to place those of us next to them in a different seat, or offer us compensation for our discomfort. When I flew next to two large sets of shoulders, I stood for most of the flight.

Posted By Sandra Zylberman on February 5, 2008, 12:54 PM

The airlines should take some responsibility for the seating situation. Most seats are only 18 inches wide. Obese people seem to be an easy target. Trust me, they are just as embarrased and miserable as anyone. What about broad shouldered men or very tall people? Sitting between them is just as uncomfortable but almost nothing is said about them paying extra.
I agree that some roomier seats should be available for an extra, but reasonable fee.

Posted By B. D. Chitwood on February 5, 2008, 2:06 PM

When I ride on a bus there are seats designated for disabled passengers and ones that flip up to accommodate wheelchairs. Let's apply the same idea. The airlines could have certain larger seats designated for obese passengers (though that presumes a certain number per flight, which could be a problem). A key piece of this logic would be that the airline would control who sits in those seats at the gate, just like they do exit rows now. No reserving ahead. Otherwise anyone who wants more room will pay more for the larger seats. I also like the Southwest idea (buy 2 seats but refund the money if the flight isn't full), but it needs to go a step further. If the flight is full, then it is the obese person who has to take another flight if he/she cannot fit in the seat, not the poor average-sized person who has no control over the situation. The airlines would also have to respect that someone HAS paid for two seats and enforce it. A number of people above clearly tried to do the right thing by buying an extra seat only to have the airline take it away from the. That's really not fair.

Posted By Martha T on February 5, 2008, 2:29 PM

Perhaps the question could be resolved with some form of measure for butt and waist width. That would eliminate the taller folks who are proportional for their size, although they should have seats reserved for them and their leg lengths. Each airline has a measuring device for size conformation for carry-on luggage, so it (they) will fit under seats and/or into overhead bins. Weight is extremely important in figuring fuel consumption, and take-off parameters for pilots. Deadly crashes have occurred on regional aircraft due to excessive weight, whether on the part of passengers or their luggage. It's highly unlikely the airlines are going to reconfigure their planes anytime soon, and while the new ones might have seats accommodating size differences, it's going to cost! I do not wish to have what little space is given to me with either oversized individuals or screaming children that 'helicopter parents' who wish to not discipline their kids, force upon me.Flying anywhere has become practically the worst part of any journey. There is no customer service of any kind on the larger level, although there are some reps who do try to make it more pleasant. Thank you to them!! However they are too few and far between. Greed seems to conquer all in this world, and expect to pay more for everything.

Posted By Kayte on February 5, 2008, 2:31 PM

Wow! The comments here really bother me as it appears most are ignoring the fact that the airlines have caused this issue by consistently reducing seat size. If the energy exerted here against obese people (read tall people, large shoulders, babies, small children, etc.) was exerted toward the airline industry you bet your bottom dollar the airline industry would change.

For one, did you all miss where the obese person (several comments here) PAID for the extra seat and STILL was DENIED USE!!! So at least some obese people are trying to comply [PERSONAL RESPONSIBILITY which I agree with], but are getting shafted not only by the airlines but probably by those same "type of people" who ignore the "I bought this seat" explanation and complain about an "obese" person sitting next to them. Have you missed the issue of recent studies pointing to small seat size and the cramp ness of airplanes CONTRIBUTING to health issues?!?! (i.e. poor air quality; thrombosis, etc.), so it's not only "obese" people!

Clearly if the energy was spent toward making the airline industry accountable and their bottom line was affected they would change. Not immediately with beautiful new fleets with advanced technology & more healthy seating arrangements but over time.

As a flying customer, am I willing to pay more to airlines pursuing new energy saving technologies/better seating & customer service - yes - can that cost be spread across the board as someone who did the math (above) suggested - yes. Can we as the customer (whether tall, small, obese, thin, etc.) who "pay" the airline industry "demand" basic decent service- yes!

Additionally, both my husband and I are no taller than 5'4"/5'6" and weigh less than 150 lbs. The only economy flight we have been truly "comfortable" on was Midwest with the 2 seats per row configuration. I see that Midwest is thriving so it is possible. And yes, we have had the experience of an obese/larger/taller/shorter/baby/children experience. And in all of them, the other person(s) was embarrassed, considerate, and tried in their "limited seat size" best to not inconvenience me. We’ve also had similar experience occur in business/first class too!- so it's not only "economy". And you know what, I was put off NOT by the person but by the airline industry and its' continued lack of standards/service for ALL paying customers. Heck, airline travel is now like bus travel with a bigger price tag!

Until we as a society pull together and focus on the true issue - the airline industry - the top executives will continue to sit back, rake in the $$ revenue, laugh at us while we fight it out amongst ourselves (obese vs. thin; tall vs. short; add your own category here) and continue to provide poor service - heck - maybe even continue to reduce the seating measurements further. Restructure is possible but greedy executives hinder the process.

Last but not least, organized protest works - if everybody (the "economy" buying people) would band together for a No Fly Day, (one day this year, and refuse to fly- I join) AND inundate the airlines with complaint letters (to include the FAA and any other airline regulation entity) that would definitely show the power of our $$ COLLECTIVELY. You can bet that will get the airline industry's attention, and then see what type of response the public gets from the airline industry - they'll be bending over backwards to avoid another "loss revenue day like that again (in terms of no flying & administrative costs due to the avalanche of complaint letters, etc.).

Come on people, when you are of the "average" size & the seat is so small that if the person in front of you reclines a bit you find your lunch in your lap - literally - or you can hardly work on your laptop, etc. (you get the drift), then isn't about time that the issue of seat size be focused on as THE ISSUE, and then the rest will follow. Review this and tell me the issue is not Seat Size:

1950’s coach standard – 23.2 inches

1960’s coach standard – 24.7

1970’s coach standard – 24 inches

1980’s coach standard – 26+ inches

1990’s coach standard – 26 minus inches

2000’s coach standard – 23.9 inches

2008's coach standard - anywhere from 17 - 21 inches???

Yes, obesity is a problem but it's the secondary issue for the airline industry. At least I give Canada credit for trying to realistically address the issue - however flawed the initial effort is. In order for that to happen here, we -the flying public- must make our effort - not toward obese people, but towards the airline industry itself.

"You're either part of the solution or you're part of the problem"

Posted By L Stephens on February 5, 2008, 3:11 PM

Sorry....but risking sounding insensitive, I
believe any passenger should pay for any add'l
space they use on the flight !!!!

Posted By jerry seigler on February 5, 2008, 3:33 PM

The trouble with questions like this is that too many people blame someone for being obese. More often than not, there are other reasons than overeating or an unhealthy life-style. I am disabled and weigh about 290 lbs. There is very little I can do to influence my weight. I fly and have very little trouble except on the regional jets. Yes, seating area has been shrinking for many years and airlines could care less if I was comfortable or not.
the idea that I should buy 2 seats is ridiculous - especially if the airlines can just put someone in it at their will. That's just wrong.
I like the idea the Canadians put into effect.

Posted By Jim on February 5, 2008, 3:57 PM

If my suitcase must fit into a bin to go under the seat or into the above bin, why shouldn't I have to fit a premeasured space also? Have a chair that each passenger must fit ALL the way into, and if they extend over the side, they must buy and use an extra seat. Coming cross country last summer, the last passenger to take the last seat was 6'4" and must have weighed 400 lbs. He took up 1/3 of the seat on either side. Nobody was comfortable for 5 hours. The stewardesses laughed at the predicament. They didn't have to share their space with him. Make each of us responsible for reserving the space that we need.

Posted By A. Gorman on February 5, 2008, 5:00 PM

Larger/obese travelers have a right to reasonable accommodations, but not the seat I paid for. I paid for 100% of my seat, and I have a right to use 100% of it. Any thought to the contrary is ludicrous.

Posted By Gretchen on February 5, 2008, 6:11 PM

As one of the remaining few who can actually fit comfortably(ish) into the seats that the airlines have continually made smaller, I have been in this predicament often. Just because I'm 5'6" and 110lbs people think I don't need the extra space and just go ahead and spill into my area, but I'm germaphobic and have had panic attacks being touched by strangers in this way. That counts as a medical problem too, but because it isn't overtly visible like obesity it's ignored. Airlines should offer wider economy seats at a premium, and the obese should be forced to purchase them or be turned off the flight.

Posted By Laural on February 5, 2008, 6:16 PM

The passenger must ask for a doble seat and pay for that. Each of us is responsible for reserving the space that we need.

Posted By carmela on February 5, 2008, 10:01 PM

I have a friend who is obese. For her comfort and that of any who may be seated next to her she booked two adjacent seats and explained why she wanted them. When she boarded the aircraft she did indeed have two adjacent seats--one on either side of the aisle. No seating adjustments were made on the aircraft nor were any refunds issued. So much for airlines meeting the clearly stated needs of the passengers.

Posted By hannahrose on February 5, 2008, 10:27 PM

Wow. As a fat chick who makes a living traveling via airplane to my work contracts I apologize to all that I have forced to share their seats with me. Obviously, I should give up my career or only travel in the back of a moving van. Or better yet I should have lipo to more immediately accommodate the rest of the world so they won't feel impositioned by my size.

So, that being decided, let's move on to chastising families with ill-mannered children who scream the entire flight and kick the back or your seat. Or passengers that douse themselves in eau d'cowswill to cover up their body odor because they can't tell when too much is too much. Perhaps we could then address persons with poor oral hygiene that fall aleep and breathe manure in your direction.

Where do we start? I know! Airlines should require pre-flight medical exams and HIV/AIDS tests pre-booking so that we are confidant the mile high club will still be a safe venture for "normal" folk.
As an added bonus, we'll be able to screen out all of those aesthetically unappealing terrorist types because they didn't pluck their brows and don't use a roll-on deodorant.

As for the fatties, perhaps we should just take over Virgin Airlines because as obviously undesirable as we all are what better moniker could we travel under? Oh, wait, there is a better one - Cattle Cars, because traveling by train is so romantic. Next stop must be the Auschwitz Fat Camp? Because you know, they really did it right! No smuggling in Twinkies or Ho-Hos there!

Good one people. Nice to see that when there are so many things truly wrong in the world - war, genocide, terrorism, the homeless, child abuse - you will all step up and tackle the big question. Flying with Fat People.

Does anyone else worry for our gene pool?

Posted By DV on February 5, 2008, 11:00 PM

I think that it's completely fair for airlines to charge, at least in part, based on the passenger's weight. Fuel charges are going up, and it costs more money for an airline to transport somebody that weighs more. Airlines already charge more for passengers to bring heavy luggage (usually 50 or more pounds), so why not charge a fee for passengers that weigh more? I also feel that if you are going to take up more than one seat, you should pay more for your ticket. I know that the system wouldn't be perfect, but I do believe that if you're taking up 1-1/2 seats and I only get 1/2 of a seat, you should pay more for your ticket than me.

Posted By Joel on February 5, 2008, 11:05 PM

It is unfortunate that obesity is a major problem in the United States. Regardless, it is unfair to other passengers if a person sitting next to them can not fit in their assigned seat and literally takes over another person's seat. Therefore, to answer the question, the burden lies on the obese passenger to comfortably sit in their assigned seat or pay for additional seating. Maybe people should be required to sit in an airline's seat before boarding to ensure they fit comfortably just like
the requirement for overhead storage.
Analogy:
If a friend and I paid evenly for 8 slices of pizza and my friend ate 6 of the 8 slices and refused to pay more for the pizza, is that fair to me?

Posted By John on February 6, 2008, 12:55 AM

The discriminatory attitudes here amaze me. If the airline CHOOSES to make seats that fit only some people, they should accomodate the people whom they omitted. They have calculated they make more money with more seats already, so they just need to cough up the extra space or create a wider seat option. Seats have become narrower over time while people have gotten statistically bigger.
And some people get really freaked out to have to touch hips with a fat person. It's tragically comic that people would rush out of the plane to avoid sitting next to a nice soft person. What about people who wear too much perfume? Should the airlines make them buy all the seats for two rows on either side? Sheesh.

Posted By Wiggy on February 6, 2008, 2:17 AM

The airlines could have a fat section with wider seats and charge accordingly.
I would make a lot of noise if I was next to a fat passenger who was taking up some of my seat. I would insist the airline move me ot the fat passenger.

Posted By Mr. Miller on February 6, 2008, 4:11 AM

I think the most plausible comments here are the ones from the people saying (and saying truthfully, come on now) that it's not only hugely obese people who cannot fit into coach seats, but slimmer people too. For the love of Mike, is there no point at which the airlines will acquiesce to reality and offer us this one lousy comfort of a bit of space, though it may cost them some money? I can't help for reflecting that an airline that simply put enough space between their seats wouldn't have this problem. And by the way, as a fit and not fat person, I don't appreciate having to contort my body eight different ways just to cut my lasagne (if it's provided).

Yes, I know, theatre seating saves money, and money is crucial to those in a competitive business. Yet we would probably save money by having passengers open their mouths and spraying them all en masse with a garden hose, instead of pouring them bottled water, and we don't do that. Airlines, come ON, already--give us some stupid space!

Posted By Ander on February 6, 2008, 4:22 AM

Hi, I think if the airlines are going to charge for an extra bag or overweight luggage they should be completely fair and weigh passenger AND bags.

I am a small person but I pay as much as people twice as heavy and then they charge me for 10 pounds extra in my bag! Not really fair is it?

Posted By Mary on February 6, 2008, 7:03 AM

Airlines should offer "plus size" seats near the lavatories. There should be an additional charge for them. First priority goes for those who are larger.

Posted By Duke on February 6, 2008, 12:42 PM

While the issue of size, be it weight or height, considerations in airline seating is admittedly a difficult one, judging from the mainly insensitive comments of the "perfectly sized" passenger I think a far greater problem is the insensitivity of any traveller who thinks that he is the only person on the plane. Where does the "perfect passenger" get off "overstuffing" the overhead space with his plus size "pushing the limit" collection of carry ons; his penchant to exit his seat or page the flight attendant an over abundance of times; or play his ipod or use his computer on high volume for the duration of a flight. And what about the self centered "perfect passenger" who talks to seat mates non-stop about his over the top accomplishments. Seems to me these "perfect passegers" are among those hanging over there arm rests and disturbing more than just the passengers assigned to the adjoining seats! Get a life folks and work on your own faults which are far to many to innumerate in this post

Posted By Bonnie on February 6, 2008, 1:06 PM

Since the cost of fuel has gone up, how about airlines starting to charge based on total weight of a person AND their baggage (including carryons)?

Strangely enough, while the average Japanese is thinner than the average American, the seats I had on JAL were more comfortable than those on American airlines. The service was incredibly better as well.

Posted By Stephanie on February 6, 2008, 2:40 PM

I think the Canadian approach to this problem will only make things worse. And I certainly don't agree with adding larger seats because that cost will be passed on to the consumers. Airline fares are already beyond ridiculous. I do not want to pay more for a ticket because another passenger can't control their weight. However, I also don't agree with passengers being made to buy an additional ticket at the last minute. I think the airlines should do what the theme parks do and post size restrictions. It would be made very clear that passengers exceeding dimensions "x" & "y" MUST purchase two seats. Passengers would have to sign a waiver before completing the purchase of their ticket. In that case, if a larger passenger shows up at the gate without the second ticket then it' no ones fault but their own.

Posted By Yari on February 6, 2008, 3:46 PM

First, the story related by Laura MacNeil 1/31/08 re- the woman who took up a third of Laura's seat and did not move, even to use the rest room, for the whole 8 hr flight. She took severe health risks in order to fly as unobtrusively as possible for hours in a small seat- heart breaking. Second, re- the small seats. The airlines are genuinely competing w/busses and autos. When I first flew between CA and IA, it was a luxury. The extra paid in airfare was for extra time at the destination. Today, I purchased airfare from LA to Des Moines because it was less expensive for my wife and I to fly than to drive. Those who believe the airlines can just sacrifice a little profit to give larger seats have been smoking the same stuff that those who believe that it doesn't cost anything to provide universal health care. We are getting what we are willing to pay for. I had thought that the airlines should ticket per seat rather than per passenger, till I read in earlier posts how this purchase was not always honored by the airlines or by fellow passengers. This is a situation where the airlines did not live up to their carriers' contracts and should have been held to account. If the airlines were held to account on these failures, all of us would be likely to be better off because of the obese who are prescient and considerate enough to purchase that second seat.

Posted By Dennis on February 6, 2008, 7:26 PM

First of all, for those "fit" people who put the blame on the obese, they can complain all they want but it won't make anyone lose weight. Second, I pay for a seat and I sit in it at 350 pounds. I always get an aisle seat, fold my arms, keep my arm rest down (arm rests that go up on the aisle side are helpful)and have never taken up anyone else's seat space. In the meantime, could you do something about the crying babies, kids crawling all over, people drinkning themselves into a stupor and cursing like sailors, and any other sort who makes my flying experience less than joyful. And shame on Delta who felt a refund and apology was in order. Delta just lost MY business!

Posted By Roy on February 6, 2008, 11:29 PM

Based upon the responses to the invitation for comments on this blog, this is a BIG DEAL (no pun intended) for many people and obviously a devisive one. First, may I suggest that the issue should not be reduced to a war between the "obese/overweight" and the "normal". I once flew surrounded by a team of college football players, none of whom were obese but all of whom were LARGE as in VERY. My head was sandwiched between the shoulders of two line backers. It was not a comfortable flight for me. My ears were continuously assaulted by the players every movement.
Factually, the airlines HAVE reduced the width of seats over time as a money saving/profit making measure, fuel prices HAVE increased, AND as well, the average American girth has expanded. Note that well over 30% of the American population is overweight by standard health measures, and that percentage is growing annually. (Ladies and gentlemen we have become a nation of overindulgent tubs of goo.)
To be fair to everyone, the airlines should simply charge a base price for seats and add a per pound surcharge which includes passenger plus baggage weight if it exceeds the limit. The planes should in addition be furnished with 30% "plus-sized seats" which would sell at a rate that is proportionately higher than the base price seats.
Space as well as weight are commodities, if you take more space or carry more weight than average than you should have to pay for it. The airline is not transporting souls, it is moving freight.

Posted By Dr Know on February 7, 2008, 1:27 PM

1) Airlines have been shrinking seats to increase profits, we can all feel this. 2) Humans are getting bigger, laterally and horizontally. 3) Loosing weight for some people is not as simple as dieting and is not an equal challenge for all (it can be rooted in genetics, early childhood environment or emotional factors.

My husband, 6'4", will not get on a plane if he can't get an aisle seat, it is just too uncomfortable for him. He has been known to wait till the next day to fly. We all have our crosses to bear and I'm sure if you are overweight this is a difficult situation for you.

Airlines are a business and in today's environment of shrinking profits many customer amenities are going bye-bye.

Posted By Ann on February 7, 2008, 1:45 PM

I believe it's the obese passenger that should pay for the space. But also agree that buying the second seat is not the issue. The airlines should provide additional seating to accomodate the obese. They have downsized and smushed us into a sardine can... I can barely fit my 5"2 size 4 into their seats these days! And pretty soon we will have to pay to check any luggage, pay for drinks, and probably end up paying to use the restroom. Travel is changing drastically...

Posted By theresa on February 7, 2008, 4:08 PM

"The airlines profit from whittling away the seat-inches so that even average-size people are uncomfortable, so they should take the financial responsibility for creating situations like this."

So true. Whittle the seats down enough and everybody gets cranky, taking it out on each other, instead of the airlines.

I'm of average weight and 5'9". On several airlines, my knees are literally jammed up against the seat in front of me. If the person in front of me reclines, the flight is nearly unbearable. I can only imagine how it must be for taller folks. The seats are too darned small and close together.

Posted By Ellerby on February 7, 2008, 6:12 PM

I think the key here is size rather than weight.

Many of the planes currently in circulation were designed and built decades ago. The shape of the average American has changed significantly since that time.

If aircraft manufacturers or the airlines that requisition new aircraft were required to do an ergonomic study, and redesign seat sizes every 10 years or so, we might not be in the situation we're in today.

Granted, eliminating some seats on an aircraft could drive prices higher in order for the airlines to maintain revenue.

What about building different size seats onto a plane, and then having a body composition scanner at each gate? (They have these in certain Levi's stores where you can get custom-fit jeans -- they're called Intellifit.) Seats are not assigned until the passenger goes through the body scanner and then the computer matches the passenger to the correct size seat.

Maybe there is a way to coordinate that type of scanning with homeland security screening devices so that a single scan tackles both tasks.

Posted By kimberly on February 7, 2008, 6:21 PM

Thank heavens the small people on this site have equally small minds. I can relax knowing that they'll fit neatly beneath the overhead compartments. To Sue who runs between 5 ad 15 miles daily (see above), you've certainly "worked" the "muscle" between your ears down to a microscopic size. My sympathies to those who must endure this kind of hostility, and my thanks to the few compassionate folks who are thin and tolerant, and hopeful for a solution that does not harm.

Posted By Carol on February 8, 2008, 1:22 AM

yes seats are small, this seems to be a known. you know this before booking your ticket, so don't pretend that somehow it's a surprise when you don't fit into a seat!

as someone who flies very frequently and often long trips (10hrs+), i'm tired of subsidizing other people's tickets.

i'm 5'7 and 125lbs - I work at this because I value my health and body.

I agree with previous posts that it is simply ridiculous that if my baggage is even slightly overweight, I pay a premium but if you add the entire weight of my bags and me, I add up to less than some of the individuals I share a seat with - put a cap on the total weight allowance for travellers (i.e. you + your baggage + ___) anyone who is over pays a premium and ensure that bags cannot weigh more than a certain amount each for baggage handler safety - sorry, it's not discrimination, it's reality - if you're shipping a package via air mail, you pay more if it weighs more, why can't this seeminly logical principle be applied to people on air planes???

Posted By shannon on February 8, 2008, 6:45 AM

I cannot believe we need our government to interviene on this issue. We are a glutinous people in America. Due to this we have several overweight, overfat, and obese people. I am in that catagory, and It is amazing how prejudice people can be in our world. All we (fat/obese/overweight) want is to be able to get to and fro just like everyone else. Most of us do not want to intrude on your personal space any more than we want you in ours. Unfortunately there are times, like this one, that we cannot be accomidated. Sadly, our airlines do not make seats wide enough for the average (whatever that is) person to be comfortable.

TO ALL THE CRUEL PEOPLE who feel the need to bash others to feel more powerful...you know!

Posted By Valerie J. on February 8, 2008, 1:02 PM

I haven't read all the comments, but my sympathy is with the big folks. I'm 5'8" and 160 lb. and it doesn't matter who sits next to me, the seats are too small. Some airlines (I'm thinking Midwest) have wider seats, and fortunately I live in a city that Midwest serves. But frankly, I purely hate to fly these days, what with the shoes-off and the nasty "food" and the packing us in like cattle. If I'm going less than 600 miles, I'm driving.

Posted By Susan on February 8, 2008, 2:23 PM

I am heavy. The only airline that I think accommodates heavy people is United. I had no problem getting the seatbelt to fasten on a united aircraft. Now, on the smaller planes I did. I only fly United.

Posted By LAUREN on February 8, 2008, 2:26 PM

Yes, an obese person should have to pay an additional charge and the airlines should provide one row with larger seats for these people.

Posted By Penny on February 8, 2008, 9:58 PM

I am 6"4" and find the coach seats on most aircraft next to impossible. On a recent flight to China (12 hours)I stood or walked around for at least 5 hours.I did not inconvenience anyone else.It seems absurd that I could have sat next to someone for 12 hours and not had complete use of the minimal amount of space given me if an obese person were next to me.

Posted By Slim O on February 9, 2008, 8:22 AM

I used to have this problem, but underwent bariatric surgery for weight reduction. Lost a lot of weight and several inches.
Some airlines are hostile to those with extra weight...given a choice, I no longer fly on them. Some morbidly obese people fly first class, so they have enough room. That's a better choice than a second seat...at about the same cost. Some airlines allow more room than others.
Some airlines allow you to book reservations with specific seats (say, an aisle seat, which is more comfortable for the larger passenger), yet you arrive at the airport only to find you are ticketed in another seat!

The only way you can change the airlines' attitudes is to complain forcefully (in writing) that you are not being properly served...and remind them how often you fly.

Posted By William Georgi on February 10, 2008, 1:25 AM

Let's remember that the airlines is inconveniencing most people today as the population gets bigger and taller, yet seats are getting smaller and leg room less in the state of "economy" flights today. I am a large woman who is very inconvenienced by the flights and try not to inconvenience others as much as possible, by 1st class upgrades where reasonable or almost squashing my arms together in front of me not to bother the other person. Though I understand the other side of the coin, it is uncomfortable and embarrasing for large people who have to shop for a seat location that might be best and ask for extenders. I don't necessarily believe people who are fat should be charged extra, because sometimes it is a health issue. I do believe that there should be 1-2 rows on plane where there are larger seats for the fatter/taller people to sit. Buying an extra seat is ridiculous, especially if the airlines is going to try to fill it regardless of you owning it.

Posted By Deb on February 10, 2008, 12:05 PM

I have been both obese and in shape and I have never fit comfortably in airline seats. I'm now 5'5", 138 lbs. The rows are too close together and you can't stretch your legs. If the person in front of you reclines their seat, watch out! There goes the 3 inches of frontal space that's yours (how come no one complains about this?)
None of the seats are wide enough--even if a person is of "normal" size, you are constantly bumping shoulders or elbows the entire flight.

For all the people who boasted about how fit they are and have such hateful words for the overweight, complain to the AIRLINES! They make the decisions to have smaller seats, to not provide options for larger or taller passengers, and to not find somewhere else for complaining thin people to sit when they don't like who they're sitting next to.

Remember, some people said that they bought extra seats and other people (probably hateful complaining thin people who felt entitled) took the seats!

Again, this falls on the airlines. Direct your anger at them, not at the overweight passengers who are stuck next to you! Maybe you can do some good and get some positive changes made.

While you are complaining to the airlines, how about mentioning the people with screaming obnoxious kids who can't or won't control them? And don't forget to mention the people who reek of either B.O., smoke, alcohol, too much nasty perfume, old food, or all of the above. Also mention the inconsiderate rude passengers who continue to LOUDLY talk (yell) into their cell phones and won't stop until the flight attendants make them. Then the second the plane lands, they're compulsively back on them frantically calling people (no doubt with the hope everyone else will think they are important rather than some pathetic insecure mess). Also complain about the drunks, people who fart the whole flight, people who are coughing and exposing the rest of us to their illness, the dirty planes, and people who are sitting in different rows who shout to each other the whole flight assuming that the rest of us give a crap about what they have to say.

These are all situations that the airlines should exert some influence on but don't. Again, direct your anger at the AIRLINES!

Posted By Dana on February 10, 2008, 8:00 PM

Flying is about economics, prices have to be greater than the costs or there will not be a provider. If the passenger is larger than the standard seating, (size and/or weight), then the market should be able to provide the appropriate seating, but the cost per larger seat increases accordingly, if the seat is 50% larger than standard, the fare should be 50% larger than standard, but how many "larger" passengers will still try to opt for the cheaper fare/smaller, standard seating and cry "discimination", and argue - why should bigger passengers pay more just because they are larger than average?
In the real world, to ship a 50% bigger package, it will cost 50% more to ship. Why should flying passengers be any different?
To force private airlines to charge one seat/one fare but provide different sized seats at the same price to accomadate bigger passengers is not justice.

Passengers should be paying their fair share to fly, if they require a larger seat, they should be charged accordingly. Not size discrimination, just simple economics.

Posted By Simple Solutions on February 11, 2008, 2:44 AM

just because your skinny doesn't mean you should have more room on an airplane. you chose your life style, why can't fat people chose theres without a penalty. as I agree that obese people take up more room than skinny people, maybe the answer is that airplanes have more room for everybody instead of treating people like sardines then everybody will be happy quite frankly thers not enough room for any adult in coach class

Posted By Patrick Vendittelli on February 11, 2008, 3:05 PM

I think this is too funny. For all you skinny people that are complaining until the airlines decides otherwise you are just going to have to put up with someone sharing your seat. If you do not like it then you buy two seats or don't fly.

Posted By Gina on February 11, 2008, 8:21 PM

I don't understand why people complain about being seated next to obese people. I was in a shuttle van from JFK that was involved in an accident. I was not injured because the obese woman next to me acted like an air bag, and I just bounced off of her. Similarly, in an airplane accident, that fat lady seated next to you might save your life.

Posted By Alan on February 11, 2008, 8:44 PM

Ah, the glorious anonymity of the Internet. It certainly frees people to speak their minds, eh?

I get the argument that if a person takes up more than one seat, he or she should pay for an extra seat. I get the argument that those who carry extra weight should get charged per pound. I even get the argument that airlines should redesign their seats (though I seriously doubt this will happen). But I have no earthly idea what the health care system, a person's eating habits or exercise routine have to do with any of this. It's a shame that people want to take pot shots at a certain category of people just because they can.

Thanks to those who articulate enough to express their perspective without spouting off their exercise and diet regimen or veering off into completely irrelevant territory just so you can cowardly talk about fat people.

Posted By Daphne on February 11, 2008, 9:04 PM

This a a very easy issue to resolve... Fat people spent a lot of money to grow their big rear end so now they should have to pay more for making everyone else miserable having to sit next to them and having to look at them! Yuck!!!!!!!!

Posted By Gary on February 16, 2008, 5:09 PM

Extra weight needs more gas to go, right?
Then overweight people should pay more.
I don't get a discount for being only 100
lbs, so why should my ticket help pay for
someone else's extra weight? They can
always buy a first class ticket to get a big seat with lots of room. I don't feel sorry
for them because of their excess weight,
after all, business is business.

Posted By BARBARA on February 18, 2008, 12:42 AM

Smaller people may not like it but the REALITY is that there are many large sized people in the world. Get used to it because we aren't going to have a world full of all skinny people overnight or by waving a magic wand. The airlines need to wake up to this fact also. It is prejudiced to not accomodate people of all shapes and sizes. A good 1/4 of airplane seats need to be much larger than they are so that people can by tickets and be comfortable for crying out loud. I guess if push came to shove and if I found out that the fuel costs are significantly more because I am overweight (I'd like to see the figures on that first) I would pay extra for a larger airline seat. People need to realize that if it were so darn simple to lose weight for everyone don't you think we would be thin? Most people don't want to be overweight but there are many factors that go into a person's weight besides just the amount of food you consume. I am tired of being judged, punished and charged to death for being overweight. There is no one that is perfect. Yes overeating often plays a big part in being overweight and so we are all supposed to bow to societies expectations and just diet and lose weight like its as easy as can be. The problem is it is not easy at all. How many of the skinny people complaining about this have other self control issues even though they may not be overweight. How many are smokers, gamblers, druggies, drinkers, shopaholics, sexaholics and the list goes on. Don't be so self righteous people, you have your issues also. There are NO perfect people in the world.

Posted By Karen on February 27, 2008, 9:28 PM

I am disabled, and have multiple sclerosis, diabetes and arthritis in most of my body.
I had to give up work due to illness,and extreme pain 5 years ago.
Because I am not very active, I have gained 73 pounds, in those 5 years.
So some people need to get their facts straight, before making a 'blanket-judgement',that being obese is my own fault.
I go on worldwide holidays every year, and don't cause anyone any problems.
I wouldn't dream of raising the armrest,or encroaching on another person's space.
So please try having a bit of compassion ,please.

Posted By Joyce Gill on March 3, 2008, 6:08 PM

For all those who think obesity is a choice that people make, please think again. While it may be a choice for some there are countless medical conditions which cause weight gain and many that cause the "gain" make it very hard to lose. Take for example, diabetes, PCOS and syndrome X. I am overweight, 270 pounds at 5'3 and carry it all in the middle. My hubby is 6'3 and 240 skinnier than meby far but still a "big boy", he wears a 36 or a 38 which is average among men. I'd love to puchase an extra seat, but its been my experience that the airline will grab it for someone and my condition is medical as is that of many obese people.

Posted By meg on March 16, 2008, 6:25 PM

Can we stop making so many generalizations and assumptions please?

First of all, it would be nearly impossible to asses people by weight alone. It would have to be by size. I am a musical theatre performer and work in a restaurant on my feet and moving quickly all day. While I weigh 270 some pounds, I am much smaller in size than many at my same weight. I look at all the people in the oh-so-popular weight loss stories where they give both the size and weight of the person and then think to myself, there is no way that they can weigh the same amount as me and be 5 sizes larger, but its true. I consider myself overweight, but not obese, even though my weight says I am. The amount of time that it would take to assess each passenger in question would cause even more chaos in already heavily-delayed airports.

Whenever I fly, I either sit with my family who is also "overweight" or spend the entire flight with my shoulders turned or my arms folded across me.

While I very easily could "seep" over into the other seat, not because of my waist but because of my shoulders and arms, I am respectful of other passengers. A majority of plus-sized people already feel self-concious enough and go out of their way to make themselves uncomfortable so that the rude, inconsiderate, and judgemental people we are sitting next to can be happy whether they deserve it or not.

There is no one answer for this problem, but critisizing people and making assumptions and generalizations about ALL (aka maybe 10%) plus-sized people is not fair to those of us who work out regularly (I'm talking personal trainer 3 times a week) and eat a normal amount (1800-2500 calories) and continue to struggle with the number that so many people like to define us by.

Posted By Brittany on March 18, 2008, 7:08 PM

Reading the comments amazes me.
1. People don't grow up thinking I want to weigh 300 pounds. Get real, and think about it.
2. I am more appalled by the thin people in this article. Greasy and smelly just because one is large? Whatever, stick to the real issue. You talk like that and suddenly nothing you say has any value. If you don't respect others, you don't earn respect for yourself.
3. I have had more issues with men (usually) of not large sizes constantly jabbing me with their elbows and cammanding the arm rests than I have with large people.
4. For the person who thought that the seats haven't suddenly shrunk, they must not have been flying long. The seats are much smaller now than they were historically - and for three people there are 2 interior armrests. Thats a battle no matter what size you are.
5. It seems from the above comments that buying 2 seats doesn't work. Some had other oassengers use them anyway, and they weren't remburst for the loss of the seat. So you're saying that it's ok for a "fat" person to pay for 2 seats and use 1 1/2, but the person on the other side only needs to pay for 1 seat, but can feel free to pertake in the 1/2 in the middle.
6. obesity has nothing to do with income. "fat" people may not have the income to buy additional seats or sit in first class. And there are times when people fly when there is no other way to get to point a to point b.
7. Frankly, I should know better not to read comments made by the general population of the US, because the always prove that they are inconsiderate, short sited, selfish, and uneducated. What a country.

Posted By JB on April 6, 2008, 10:14 PM

Bottom line, I don't care that anyone is obese - I care about the fact that they are taking up more than the seat they paid for. The seats are tight and the room is non-existant, I don't need the person in the seat next to me sitting in my seat too - it's not about money

Posted By Linda on April 7, 2008, 1:47 PM

Wow, I clicked on this converstion out of curiosity. People are much more willing to be upset while typing on the internet, hiding behind a computer screen. The comments of "sweaty fat people" are vulgar in my opinion. Also, the pointing out of how much you weigh and your height, your exercise routine etc, is quite unattractive. I agree, buying an extra seat is not logical. Your seat WILL be taken up somehow so I say to the airline, PLEASE, that is not helping. The airlines are very ready to be extremely unhelpful. I fly cross country 3 times a year, and I am always uncomfotable. If this is bad for me, I could only imagine how an overweight person would be extremely anxious to fly, possibly even missing interviews, family events, traveling and this will only add to the depression that extra weight brings on. THe idea of having a special " fat people area" also has to be embarrassing. How long will it be until normal size people are reserving these seats and bringing the same issue. This seems to be a problem with no easy answers.

Posted By Jessica on April 7, 2008, 3:47 PM

Ok- at what point is the person charged extra? Who makes that decision? I can't believe the cruelty of some of these comments. I have a sister that has had thryoid cancer and so her metabolism is almost at a standstill. There are also many other diseases- like the poor people that have to be on steroids for forms of leukemia, cancer, etc. To look at them you wouldn't know it but they certainly are not eating nonstop and not putting down the fork. I hope it never happens to you because you will see how terribly people will judge you because of an unseen disease.

Posted By Linda on April 10, 2008, 12:42 PM

Airlines need to start charging passengers per lb. for the entire weight they bring on the plane...personal weight plus luggage, carry ons, etc.

Posted By mary edmondson on April 10, 2008, 2:32 PM

I'm a flight attendant with 10 yrs of experience, and when I fly (as a stand-by) I'm the one next to the obese person no one else will sit by. I can't complain, because I'm flying for free. But the comments of Denise, above, worry me. If you are disabled, as you insist you are, you have absolutely no business accepting an exit row seat, much less requesting one! None at all! I have encountered situations where obese people were jeopardizing every other passenger on the plane. It's patently unacceptable! If there is no place to put them other than an exit row, then they can't ride on that aircraft, period! It doesn't matter WHY a person is so big, they just ARE, period. They don't buy twin beds for their home, they make sure the hotel where they're staying has a king bed, they need to buy two seats and insist that they keep the extra seat free when uninformed flight attendants or other passengers commandeer the extra seat. If you cannot QUICKLY and EASILY maneuver the exit door open and get yourself though the tiny exit door, you shouldn't be there. Even if you just APPEAR unable to do so, you are illegal to sit there.

Posted By Toni Vitanza on April 13, 2008, 6:43 PM

As the airlines are in pathetic financial shape, why not charge an extra fee if a person's weight exceeds a given amount. Those who greatly exceed average weights based on gender, will pay for the space and additional fuel used in flight. The airlines weigh the luggage; why not weigh the passengers?

Posted By D. G. Griffin on April 14, 2008, 1:05 PM

I am 6'2" 220lbs. While I could shed a few pounds, I am not generally considered to be obese. If I am next to another normal sized person, we touch at the shoulders. The answer is not in larger seats, but in allowing some room to exist between the seats that are currently in place.

Posted By Jack St Arnold on April 14, 2008, 2:35 PM

The airlines offer a travel service and you are purchasing a specific space on that flight. If you need more space than they are offering, buy more space.

I don't believe in rewarding obesity. But, perhaps in kindness the airlines, when selling the 'double space', could re-name it something else like 'comfort zone seating' or something. Maybe even give it a bit of a discount. Tall, stocky, and obese persons would benefit as well as those of us who just want a little extra space anyway.

Posted By The Mysterious Lady on April 16, 2008, 10:41 AM

International airlines (Asian, particularly) now penalize air travelers exceeding 20kg single-check baggage limits enough to routinely double air fairs. Overall weight-based ticket fares (totalizing passengers and luggage) may be the most equitable, while handsomely rewarding obese passengers to resolve their grave health issues (many cancers, heart attacks, strokes, diabetes, etc.) Obese passengers, like smokers, shoulder enormous medical risks and medical expense burdens shared additionally by society at large. Such "mass-weighted" ticketing, moreover, might serve as a "revenues magnet" for health- oriented airlines (drawing trim customes away from more costly and crowded "unhealthy" airlines). "Health incentives travel" creates ultimate winners in all, except OPEC.

Posted By Cancer Watcher on April 17, 2008, 7:13 AM

I don't know the answer, but something should be done. Airlines do offer first class seats that have more room, for more money. My overweight family member buys first class seats when flying. It isn't fare to other passengers when the over-weight person takes up their space and yours. The problem is so wide spread I hate to fly anymore. Maybe if everyone gives up flying for a year or so the airlines will do something to get passengers back.

Posted By Linda on April 17, 2008, 4:28 PM

I have paid my seat and my wifes seat. (with my retirement funds) and I do not appreciate anyone large or small helping me enjoying my space..We have had bad times with large people. Airlines should request large people to sit in a special row.

Posted By Bill H..Buffalo,NY on April 18, 2008, 11:29 AM

I can not believe the rudeness of these comments concerning obese people. Do you realize that if you are 10 pounds over your chart weight you are obese yourself. If loseing weight was so easy to do dieting would not be a billion dollar industry. I agree that it is uncomfortable to be cramped in a tiny airline seat sized for a "slender" child or very petite person. If you stop to think about it most basketball & football players would have to buy extra seats for their long legs or broad shoulders and some because they are obese. No one likes being obese, and there are many problems that cause or contribute to this problem such as accidents that make it extremely difficulty to get the proper exercise. Some of us can't afford to but the proper food to eat. And many of us pray we don't have to sit next to these politically correct people that are blessed with not haveing the propensity to gain weight because their "quiet rudeness" is just as hard for us to bear. Not all obese people sweat, stink or give off offensive odors, most of us bathe frequently to prevent this and when forced to fly we do all we can to draw ourself to gather in the smallest possible space so as not to offend our seat companions. You have no idea of the physical pain this can cause, because you do not know why the person is obese and you don't care. If you got out of your little "Me" world maybe you would learn to have some compassion for others.

Yes I agree the airlines could place a few seats with extra leg or seat room on their flights.

Posted By Lee on April 19, 2008, 9:39 AM

It's as simple as this: if you take the space of two seats, you pay for two seats. Otherwise, the person sitting next to the obese person should get 1/2 off of the price of their seat since they're not getting full use of it.

Posted By Kelly on April 19, 2008, 8:43 PM

I recently flew on a Jet Blue flight with my family and had the distinct displeasure of sitting next to a man who was well over 375LB by my estimation. It was the most uncomfortable flight as I am a 190 LB man and this man spilled over into one third of my seat. With a full plane there was no opportunity to relocate. If I wasn't with my family, I would have exited the plan rather than endure this extremely uncomfortable predicament for 3 plus hours. In fact, I would have not even opted for that seat for a free flight - it was that uncomfortable. This is not an anti-obese crusade but rather a statement that Airlines - at least Jet Blue in this instance - do not address the issue of whether or not an obese passenger is permitted to occupy a portion of another passengers seat. The issue is as simple as that...if a person infringes on the physical space of another passenger than he should be forced to purchase another seat or wait for a flight with an open seat next to his/her paid seat. There is absolutely no justification for permitting one passenger from infringing on the physical space of another. This is why smoking was prohibited on all flights (second hand smoke) and all music/entertainment must be utilized with headphones - so as not to disturb other passengers. Jet Blue offered me a paltry Credit for a future flight - rather than a refund to my credit card and most upsetting Jet Blue stated that they encourage obese passengers to purchase a 2nd seat (while admitting that they do not screen people for their weight) for their OWN comfort. The inconvenienced passenger who pays full fare and only asks for use of his full seat is left to suffer. I see absolutely no justification for this policy and no need to utilize Jet Blue in the future. For what its worth, the in flight Jet Blue crew were extremely sympathetic and in complete accord with me and voiced that this occurs quite often with no help from Jet Blue Corporate.

Posted By Robert W. Chasanoff on April 23, 2008, 9:07 PM

Southwest Airlines encourages large passengers to book two adjacent seats. If you do this and the flight isn’t sold out, you can request a refund after the trip by calling Southwest Customer Relations (214/792-4223) or sending the airline your flight information. [submitted via email to Budget Travel's 20 Tips department]

Posted By Dayle Cohoon, Tracy, Calif. on April 28, 2008, 4:35 PM

It is really sad that we judge people, still today, only by their outward appearance. I find it comical and sad to read people's comments like" put down that corn syrup....". Not every obese person has an eating disorder, many are clinically obese for a reason that a skinny gene person could never understand. If they are rewuired to "pay more" then shouldn't the airline afford more to that passenger? Why should they pay more, for the same seat as the skinny person?? Because they spill over? Well make the seats larger than 17" and sell THOSE seats for more---guaranteed you will see all the skinny people buy them up. It isn't about 'spillage' or obesity, it's about invading people's personal space, and let's face it- in an ignorant, non-civil society that we live in today- no one wants anyone in their personal space. I am considered obese, by national standard, however- I have an extremely healthy record from my physician. My cholesterol, heart rate, BP, etc is all perfect. I am active, healthy, and overweight. I have a sever thyroid condition that prevents me from losing weight, despite an extremly healthy diet of whole grains, vegetables, low fat items, and lots of water. I never drink soda, never eat fast food - but VOILE- still fat ! Then I see the skinny person who is an alcoholic, a drug user, smells, a purger, a thief, a chain smoker, ---well maybe I don't want to sit next to them!!

Posted By Sandy L. on June 16, 2008, 7:23 AM

Airlines need policies. Without policies, obese passengers and their neighbors will both end up dissatisfied. Why does Southwest seem to be the only airline with an actual policy? Their policy is neither perfect nor perfectly enforced, but at least it exists.

Posted By ss on June 21, 2008, 10:17 AM

I am an overweight passenger though have never had to pay extra. Like a few other commentors, I have struggled with weight since I was a child. As a result, I have an eating disorder now. If you don't know there is a lot of physical and psychological issues involved. I'm working on it with a great team but for now, I'm still fat. Ever since this issue first arrived, my biggeset flying fear has been that I will be singled out and asked to pay. The few times I've had to sit by strangers, I've gone out of my way to stay out of their personal space, no matter the discomfort to me.
Some of the people are bullies on here that are no better than elementary school bullies. I wish this weren't a problem, but it is.

Posted By kk on June 25, 2008, 11:48 AM

I love all the comments from the "skinny people" who obviously think the world belongs to them because they have good metabolisms. I weigh 300 pounds. In high school, I weighed 150. A few years after high school, my weight shot up 100 pounds in a very short amount of time for no reason. I was later diagnosed with polycystic ovarian syndrome and hypothyroidism. At the time my weight shot up, I was riding a bike 10 miles per day and eating the same amount I always had. I struggle with my weight and the pain of my myriad of other symptoms. It takes three times or more the amount of a normal person's dieting and exercise for me to lose weight, and if I don't keep that up constantly, I gain all the weight back plus some. Seeing as how my other symptoms often interfere with my life, I can't always keep up a rigid exercise regimen. My weight fluctuates constantly, and I suffer every day because of it. There are more people like me out there than you know. Not all obese people are obese beacuse they sit around eating nothing but Twinkies all day long. I deal with my situation as best I can, and I resent that someone thinks I need to be fined for something that is beyond my control. If an overweight person "spills over" into your seat, blame the greedy airline that shrunk those seats in order to cram more cattle on the plane and make more millions. If those seats were just the smallest bit larger, the majority of overweight people would not encroach at all. Remember that these seats are basically benches with armrests in between, not separate seats. How are you supposed to NOT encroach on someone when you're sitting on a tiny bench right on top of each other? Be thankful for your good fortune and that you don't have to deal with the things some of us suffer with on a daily basis. The airlines should either expand their seat sizes, divide the seats into actually "seats" and not benches, or offer certain sections at the SAME PRICE that are larger than others to accommodate people of size. We're treated like crap on a daily basis already - we shouldn't have to also deal with America's "weight patrol" telling us we don't deserve to travel.

Posted By Kissy Fernandez on July 15, 2008, 5:31 PM

I'm not obese,but at 5'6 and 153lbs,I am clinically overweight. I was 162 for a while and that was the worst. So I know how it feels to be "big". But I won't say it was because of a disease or some other problem,it was because I liked food too much.I'm currently trying to get down to 140 before my trip begins. Anyway,obese passengers should be charged more. I remember sitting next to an obese person on a train and he was all over me. I was grossed out because I hate people touching me and then he was pretty dirty,so I was pretty damn angry. You can't automatically blame it on a disorder or something,because my sister&mother both have thyroid issues. They are not obese. There should be like a 20$ fee or something. America needs to do something about it's weight problem. I don't ever want to be 162lbs again. I really love eating,but I don't love it that much.

Posted By Trizie on July 17, 2008, 12:15 PM

First remember that the airlines have made the seats smaller than they were several years ago so they could get more people in the plane.
sure, charge us big people more but the charge the small people less, it's onlt fair.

Posted By Harold on July 28, 2008, 12:18 PM

If you are obese, for whatever reason, eat less and exercise more and you will lose weight. Just because you have a thyroid condition doesn't mean you will automatically be fat--you just have to eat less (and better) and exercise more than someone who doesn't have such a condition. No more of an issue than having problems with alcohol because of your genetic makeup means that you have to drink to excess. Yes, I have thyroid problems, too, and I work hard every day to keep from getting fat. But if I did let myself go, I would expect to pay extra for a second seat if I needed it.

Also, someone in the normal weight range should not have to subsidize someone who is overweight (or disabled in some other way for that matter) either through giving up part of their seat, or requiring the airline to give them an extra seat at "no charge." Of course the cost of that "no charge" seat will be passed on to all the other passengers.

Posted By Paul on July 28, 2008, 1:08 PM

Flying is a privilege, not a right. If you take up the space of two people, you pay for two people- plain and simple. Air travel is an industry- a money making industry- it is not a universal 'must' for basic survival such as clean water, food, shelter, healthcare (in other words, things that should be made available to all equally). Why should airlines lose SERIOUS money because Americans are eating themselves to death? Seriously, that is not their problem. Buy a second seat.

Can you ship 500 pounds of your luggage on a plane? No, because it takes up more than its share of space. If something -person, animal, object- is too heavy for its alotted space, there are other ways to travel, such as by bus, car, boat, etc. Not everyone is entitled to fly, and not every can fit in the seat. Babies are tiny, so they pay less. Obese people are large so they should pay more. It makes sense.

Posted By SW on July 28, 2008, 1:49 PM

I think there should be a distinction drawn between overweight and grossly obese. There must be some maximum pound amount that airline chairs can reasonably be expected to accommodate. We all know it's a tight space, however, people come in all shapes and sizes. If marketers wish access to the American market, they should not be allowed to segment that market by size for additional profit.

The trend to charge larger people more seems to be catching on, and it is disturbing to me. I am tall, and I regularly pay $2-4 extra for the larger sizes. I believe this is wrong--the price should be the same for all. If this trend were carried to its natural progression, restaurants could refuse to seat thin people on the assumption that they would not order enough food items. Certainly, short people would not be allowed to drive due the compromised sightlines. Children could certainly be barred from restaurants due to the additional cleaning and supervision requirements. The elderly could be barred from fast-food eateries due to their inability to consume at a rapid rate, thereby cutting into profit margins. It goes on and on.

Given, there are extremes in everything, but there should be a reasonable range of height and girth that services and retailers should be expected to accommodate--and without additional charge.

JL

Posted By JL on July 28, 2008, 2:39 PM

Can your magazine please forward comments to all the airlines? Obviously this is an issue that needs to be addressed. I'm 5'6 and thin and I feel cramped in those small coach seats. I can't imagine how a taller or bigger person feels in those seats. The airlines can do something instead of letting it turn into an issue of us against them.

Posted By jw on July 28, 2008, 2:40 PM

The fact is that not all overweight people are that way due to unhealthy eating and lack of exercise or laziness. Many have medical conditions or are on medications that caused weight gain. Some gained weight after childbirth and are too busy running after kids to focus on losing weight. People of all shapes and sizes have the need to travel so the airlines should have seating to accommodate them all. Lord knows they charge enough money to afford to add a few larger seats. Any NO, I'm not overweight, I just have a heart.

Posted By T.T on July 28, 2008, 2:53 PM

Sadly the airlines have made seating smaller to accomodate more people = more revenue. I think everyone should travel, etc. however, if you don't fit in one seat, you buy another. It isn't being mean, it is price per seat. So if you're very overweight and want to fly you know beforehand the cost, and if it's worth it to you, save for the airfare cost. Luckily United has started to offer economy plus seating, which is extremely reasonable, and offers that extra space I think every economy person would want whether small, medium, or large in size. I have to say United is really stepping up to the plate on this one, and listening to the customers suggestions/needs.

Posted By vanessa on July 28, 2008, 2:58 PM

First, lets discuss economics. If all of us obese [by the way the standard keeps changing so even if YOU are not obese today YOU could be tomorrow) don't fly because we can't afford it, the airlines will have to raise their prices to compensate for the loss of revenu4e and you skinny people will deservedly have to bear the cost.

That's right, some idiot in Washington gets up in the morning and looks at a fat person and is repulsed and says "I'm going to make all people look like me, skinny and oh so perfect>" and changes the weight to height ratio because he thinks people should be a reflection of his self. We obese people don't ask you weight challenged -that's right we like being obese and think you skinny people are the sicko ones- we don't ask you to gain weight, why do you have to feel it necessary to bother us?

SEcond a point of personal observation, when I fly I notice it is invariably the petite people who just have to lean their seats back all the way. You don't mind penetrating the airspace of the person behind you, but you are complaining that people invade your space?

Could it be that the rest of us have too much respect for our fellow passengers to inflict this on them, and it's we who are considerate, and not you?

Posted By Jerry on July 28, 2008, 3:16 PM

The average person in the U.S. is ten pounds heavier than twenty-five years ago. That is about a ton and a half extra load on a wide bodied jet. This extra weight is a large extra cost for the airlines. Perhaps we should all be paying for tickets by the pound.

Posted By Roger on July 28, 2008, 3:23 PM

YES!! They should pay. I flew from Nashville to Houston in January on Southwest. I was in the aisle seat when a very large women asked for the window. I got up and she raised the armrests between the seats as she extended into the middle seat. Then, just as we got ready to leave, her husband, also extremely large came up and said he needed to get in. At that point, I lowered the armrest and got up. The stewardess told me to take my seat and buckle up. I told her the guy couldn't get into the seat. She then demanded that I get in and buckle my belt. She said it was a full flight and they had no more seats. The guy finally managed to get seated, but he was leaning over into my seat. Thus, when I got seated, his right shoulder was in front of my left arm. I leaned to the right and the stewardess bumped into me. She told me to sit straight and I asked her how to do that? Her reply was to "do your best". What a nightmare couple of hours to Houston. I would have gotten off, but I had to make the connection in Houston. Once again, the rights of the victim are trampled on because the guilty have all the rights.

Posted By Ronald L Williams on July 28, 2008, 4:30 PM

I wonder what an airline would do if a planeload of people going to a convention of obese people all took the same flight? The plane might not be able to get off the ground. The Air Force has loadmasters for its cargo planes to insure that the cargo is properly balanced and not excessively heavy.
Extra weight calls for an extra charge.
If I were obese I simply would not fly rather than provide an inconvenience to others, assuming seats stay the size they are.
Ray
Ray.

Posted By Ray on July 28, 2008, 4:33 PM

I believe if a person takes up more than their assigned seat because of weight they should have to pay for the space they occupy.obviously if you need 2 seats because of weight you should pay for 2 seats. If the airline asked the question of size before accepting a reservation and set a weight at which a person would need to pay for 2 seats that would be helpful to other passengers who are not obese.Just as the airlines do when a child is a certain age and has to have their own seat instead of sitting on someones lap.

Posted By VERA BURDETTA on July 28, 2008, 5:24 PM

It seems logical that if an airline charges more for overweight luggage, that passenger weights should also have limits. With airlines struggling to stay in business, I think it's reasonable for them to charge more for passengers over weight limits that require more fuel.

Obesity is costing all of us huge amounts of money because of diabetes, heart and orthopedic diseases that medicare and medicaid must treat. Most of these are optional health problems caused by eating the wrong food, wrong amounts and not exercising.

Posted By Maureen Holloway on July 28, 2008, 5:58 PM

This is a really sad conversation to read. I am sure it has been mentioned somewhere in these hundreds of posts that the current statistics are that 66% of Americans are overweight, with over 30% categorized as obese. This means that someone you love is likely obese. Your mom/dad, brother/sister, spouse, child – someone you love is obese. And then I read comments like “sweaty, fat people”, “greasy, obese person”. You all should be ashamed for being so intolerant. Being discriminatory against the overweight is one of the last socially acceptable biases, as this forum is proving quite well.

I don’t know what the solution is for the seat dilemma. Having overweight people not fly is simply not a solution. That would cut into the airlines bottom line by up to 65% as referenced above. Maybe that is why the airlines have been slow to do anything about it? If they start enforcing weigh-ins, do you think they could afford the drop in sales because 65% of their passengers would not participate in such humiliation? The airlines have enough problems right now.

I think that if we are going to begin sectioning out airplanes with seats for larger passengers, let’s also create a section for people traveling with small children, smokers going through withdrawal on the flight, people with bad breath/body odor, those likely to fall asleep and snore in your ear, and loud talkers. That way, those of us who are perfect can have our own little special section of the plane. That sounds like a great idea!

Posted By Jessica on July 28, 2008, 7:28 PM

A friend purchased 2 tickets and they wouldn't give her 2 seats together....she was so uncomfortable that she actually sat on the floor for part of the trip and no one tried to stop her....and she got no refund for the 2nd seat either.

Posted By Sue on July 28, 2008, 7:43 PM

It's funny how this bcomes should obese people pay more instead of why are the airlines allowed to make the seats so small? I am normal weight and still the seat was not big enough for me. Let's put blame where it belongs, with the airlines! They would have us turn on each other like chickens at a pecking party instead of looking at who is really to blame.

Posted By LInda Moore on July 28, 2008, 8:45 PM

I have a solution to the seat issue for planes and college football stadiums. Have a cement or steel guide the width of the seat that people need to walk through, same as the guide that your carry-on needs to fit into. If you don't fit into the guide with ease, you need to buy an extra seat.

Posted By Chris on July 28, 2008, 11:02 PM

I can't believe some of the cruel comments people have made. Airlines are going to make whatever rules they want regarding the purchase of an extra seat for people who are obese. I pity the airline employee who has that job of forcing people to buy a 2nd seat. I do not want to sit next to or near children on a flight. That is a worse fate! I am 5'6" and weigh 125lbs. so fitting into the seat is not the issue...my knees are. I have very long legs and cringe when the individual in front of me reclines their seat. I always get an aisle seat so I can stretch out. Once on Southwest I got on the flight late and didn't understand why an aisle seat remained open with the plane almost full. The individual in the middle was a large woman with her young son in the window seat. I took that seat because it's more important for me to stretch my legs out into the aisle than be squeezed in the middle seat. Yes she did cross over into my seat but I had the aisle. Does anybody see Broadway shows in NYC? Those seats are tiny!!! I am physically uncomfortable in those seats.

Posted By sauvichick on July 28, 2008, 11:54 PM

I am obese. Sure wish I wasn't, and contrary to what many on this blog seem to think, it isn't my choice or anything that is within my control. I do need an seat belt extension but I can get in the seat with the arms down. Not comfortably mind you, but it does contain my all to wide behind into the seat. On a Southwest flight to Tampa a few years back, after going past the ticket taker, down the ramp, down the aisle, finding a seat that was not next to anyone, and putting down the arm rest to make sure that I could do so. . .I was approached by a young man who informed me that I could stay on the flight this time as it was not fully booked, but would need to purchase to seats in the future, including for my return trip the next week! I am to old and to ornery to be mortified...but it sure did make me angry that it was handled in that manner. Who makes these decisions, and how? What if I did not have the resources to buy an extra ticket for the return flight? Was I then to forfeit the money that I had spent and get up and exit the plane? Would I be stranded in Tampa? Should not the fact that I was in the seat with the arms down serve as evidence that I could fit in one seat? While in Florida, I came up with a few suggestions for SouthWest to assure that these decisions were not to be made arbitrarily in the future. Have everyone step on a public scales before they enter..of course you will probably not have many passengers, particularly women! Then there would be plenty of room, and it would not be an issue. Or they could put marks on the wall, and have everyone press their behinds up against the wall to demonstrate that they fit into the seat!
That could be fun! On my return flight, while I made sure that I did have the money for an extra ticket if needed, I was fully prepared to make a scene if necessary. I figured if SW did not mind trying to embarrass me in the manner of which they handled the first flight, the least I could do was return the favor. It was actually quite anti-climatic when I got in the boarding line, handed them my single ticket, and got on without anyone mentioning anything to me about my size.
To those of you who have made all the snide and often ignorant remarks in this comments section, might I suggest that you try a little harder to be thankful instead of smug regarding your size. And to the airlines, be careful of who you decide to mess with , because not all of us fat folks are compliant and to lazy to fight back...and very few of us are jolly, regardless of the stereotype!

Posted By waynep on July 29, 2008, 9:10 AM

If I am charged more for my heavier baggage, even if it is a bicycle that keeps me in shape, then why shouldn't someone carrying around their own extra baggage be charged as well! Airlines are trying everything to lighten airplanes and penalizing passengers who choose to travel with extra baggage. The same should apply to passengers inside the cabin as well.

Posted By Patti on July 29, 2008, 10:35 AM

I read the post below and I wanted to be sick. First and foremost concerning seats, yes it would be nice to put seats with a bit more room and charge extra for them, but if the airlines did that there would be many less seats on the plane so therefore those seats would not be much cheaper than first class, or would raise the price of all seats overall to make up for lost seats.
They also have this thing called business class, not first class, not economy, but bigger seats!

I have been stuck numerous times next to very overweight individuals on a plane. Once I couldn't get in or out of my seat. When I tried to use the bathroom the person basically huffed and complained. It was an 8 hour flight, sorry but its unhealthy to not get up and move at some point to get blood flowing. I politely explained that he would have to move and that he can't force me to stay in my seat.

I am a very fit person but I am realistic and realize not everyone is going to workout or eat as healthy as i do, but there is a difference between being 5'6" and 200 lbs, and being 5'6" and 300 pounds. One is a person who is trying or really does have issues losing weight. 300 pounds is pure sloth.

As for the comment below it makes me ill. If her aunt was so big she got stuck in a booth and an ems almost had to be called, FOR THE LOVE OF GOD WHY WAS SHE EATING AT A TACO BELL!!!! There is no reason to charge someone extra for that much room. And on a side note that really bugs me when i go out to eat and i cant reach the table because the booths are so big to accommodate the severely obese. Skinny people eat too!

Another gentleman pointed out what about the tall. I agree they can't shrink, but obese people can stop eating taco bell, and no a diet coke doesn't count.

Her Post
"Creating larger seats for obese patrons sound reasonable, but at what cost? At 160 lbs, I'm not obese, but if I had a choice to be very comfortable in a larger seat I would pay a little more for that comfort. I have an aunt who is obese and I know the pressures that come with being overweight. While dining out at Taco Bell, my aunt got stuck in the booth/table. We almost had to call the EMS squad to get her out, but she painfully wiggled out of the seat. If the restaurant had larger seats, we would have sat in them and saved her the embarrasment of getting stuck."

Posted By Cass on July 29, 2008, 1:43 PM

So Patti, I assume your comment means that you would support a charge on a man who is 6'6" and weighs 200 pounds as you would on a woman who is 5'2" and weighs 200 pounds although one is classified as overweight and the other is not?

Posted By Jessica on July 29, 2008, 2:25 PM

I like the idea of paying for tickets by the total weight of you and your luggage. Practically speaking I'm not sure how the airlines would accomplish this but the weight and balance of airplanes is very critical. On a recent flight I was flying standby and after already in a seat I was asked to leave the plane (along with the person who got on right before me - also on standby) because the plane was overweight. I fly standby quite often and that has never happened to me before. I'm only about 170lbs and the other person was smaller than me but our extra 300lbs made a difference. (I guess I should be glad I wasn't left on a flight that was allowed to fly over its weight limit). Every few pounds increases the fuel usage on these planes. Like or or not that's just a fact. When you look at the facts on saving fuel in your vehicle it is said to not carry any additional items in your trunk as even an additional 10-20lbs can decrease your fuel mileage.

Posted By Jan on July 29, 2008, 3:34 PM

This is a really dumb question! The question should be in a country where 70 percent of the population is obese, why does the airlines keep shrinking the seats! I am 6'6", 270 pounds not obese! But it feels like I am doing jail time in economy class airlines seats. I am sure some of your readers feel that if I were to shrink there would be no problem. I guess most people feel if it is not my problem there is no problem!!

Posted By Ralph Long on July 29, 2008, 8:38 PM

Go ahead airlines...cram us in tighter and tighter. Make it as uncomfortable to fly as you can...You'll lose more people like me, who can afford to fly, but who'd rather not because of the discomfort. And whoever designed 5 seats crammed in the middle of plans should be forced to sit smack in the middle. You're making us claustrophobic! I've read about size, smell, sound, and other irritations--how about redesigning seats and trays for maximum comfort instead of maximum bucks. Charge us more. The industry might just get healthier. Make our aisles wider so we can walk comfortably...the stiffness and pain I feel from being so cramped always makes me want to 'bolt' as soon as the plane lands. We'd fly more if it were a more enjoyable experience.

Oh, by the way, my artificial knee will always single me out to take up the time of airport personnel while they do their ridiculous routine on me each leg of my flights. Thank goodness in Europe they just waived this arthritic, retired teacher through by sensible and professional profiling. Let's get with it, airline industry--were getting fatter, older, and more metallic--we're also going to be crankier unless you take better care of your 'audience.'

I used to love flying.

Posted By Sharon on July 30, 2008, 11:19 PM

This has a simple solution.....reverse the middle seat. Yeah, that means the middle seat flys "backwards" but big deal. No one is shoulder-to-shoulder anymore

Posted By Anthony on July 31, 2008, 10:07 AM

I diet and exercise and pass up junk for healthy food. Why should I have to shrink in my seat to accommodate an obese person-especially in an international flight? Come on-I didn't force any obese person to overeat-don't penalize me!

Posted By Barbara on July 31, 2008, 12:48 PM

While I understand the issues of fairness regarding obese people taking up some of your seat, this sort of dialogue scares me because I feel obesity is the last acceptable bastion of discrimination. As someone who has always been a large woman (most people would not say I am obese, but at 5'10", 200 lbs, with shoulder bones as broad as a football player) I am definitely not small. I would pay more for a larger seat on any airline, but I can afford to do so and refuse to fly those airlines who have ridiculous crowded seats. And what about the person who reclines into you from the front? I once kept my knees firmly in the back of someone in front of me who insisted in reclining so far I couldn't put my tray down. and I have a flat stomach. It was crazy. I just feel like the "thin police" are invading every aspect of our lives.

Posted By Karla on July 31, 2008, 1:07 PM

As a frequent flyer, I'm 5'8" and 140 lbs. My husband is 6'4" and 225 (and all muscle). I agree, the seats are very small and very uncomfortable; however, I do not appreciate having to share an already cramped situation with an individual who, (although) may have a legitimate "medical condition," uses their "diagnosis" as an excuse to overindulge their sweet tooth.

My girlfriend has an underactive thyroid condition. Granted, she's not as thin as she would like, but by no means is she even anywhere near being overweight.

For years I've battled the pain of two herniated discs and have endured long treatments of steroids...not to mention long periods of inactivity. Of course, that caused me to gain weight! My jeans got tight, but it didn't make me obese. All it takes is a little self control.

Being a bit chubby might be due to genetics or a medical condition, but obesity is a choice. They should stop trying to be treated "special" because of their size ... and inability to stay away from the buffet table.

Maybe the money the obese are paying to go on vacation would be better well spent going to a gym and a nutritionist.

If you're going to feel sorry for someone, have some sympathy for the tall people being cramped. Airlines should accomodate for more leg room in coach...not wider seats. Genetics is the reason that made tall people large...not a fork.

Posted By leggyblonde on July 31, 2008, 2:37 PM

My sister and I recently took a 2 hour flight. A person who was obeses was sitting next to us in the aisle. We made sure to go to the bathroom before the plane left the airport to not be bothersome. This person was not happy that we got up before the plane took off. The person refused to move when we returned, and we literally had to climb over the indiviual to get back to our seats. It was uncomfortable for us, and obviously bothersome for the person.

Discrimination is out there. In many cases, obesity can be controlled, but not always. It seems like no matter how airlines and traveler try to work it out, someone always gets squashed.

Posted By Travler on August 1, 2008, 7:57 PM

I just have to say I am so disturbed at how prejudiced some of you people are. If you cannot comment on this issue without making disgusting and cruel comments about overweight people, you are PREJUDICED. You can state your opinion without judging others and acting like you know everything that's going on in their lives. I have two aunts who are overweight because of health conditions and the medicines they have to use to control them. Neither one eats red meat, and neither one has a "sweet tooth." They eat mostly chicken, drink Carnation for breakfast, salads for lunch - quit acting like you know people's business!

I know that it can be uncomfortable to be seated next to a severely overweight person on a crappy airline. But except in very extreme cases of obesity, most of these people would fit perfectly into a seat if the seats were actually seats! The airlines have turned them into benches, and considering how small these benches are, I usually can't even sit next to two other thin people without accidentally bumping or touching them at some point during the flight. If the airlines separated the seats, I believe this issue would all but go away.

Some of you with your hateful comments should save it for the airlines. Bring back seats instead of connected benches and we could probably all be comfortable!

Posted By Angelina Robertson on August 2, 2008, 1:58 AM

Whether or not a person has a medical problem for being obese or not, it still makes it very uncomfortable to have someone extra large hanging over into my seatspace. I paid for my space and think if you are bigger than your seat you should buy a first class ticket or pay extra for another seat in coach. When you are smashed up against the window by an obese passenger, it ruins your trip and can cause your own pain from having to pull yourself away from their body. I will and have always asked the flight attendant to move me so I can be comfortable during my flight. If there is no room to move, I will think twice before flying that airline again. I am tired of obese passengers blaming the rest of us for their weight problem. If they don't fit in the seat then it is their responsibility to solve it---not mine.

Posted By Kathy on August 4, 2008, 12:31 PM

I am on the obese side, however I am large to begin with. But I always fly first or business class. Just try charging me extra. See what kind of lawsuits you get. My comfort and service already costs 4-5 times what paid for your coach class seat.

I pity those who have purchased and extra seat for themselves and have it stolen by some inconsiderate person who "just wants to put their baby down for a second." I would loudly and proudly boot them and the kid out of the seat I paid for. The people who have had this happen to them and not had their money refunded have lawsuit material and should threaten to sue for their money back.

There are too many self-righteous people on this blog who solely exist to belittle those who are less fortunate than themselves in order to feel better about their own miserable existences. No everyone is obese by choice, you know. Some have glandular issues.

The airlines have squeezed every last penny of profit out of transporting people like cattle, with seats and legroom quickly disappearing, flight personnel acting like police, and the passengers all eyeing each other up to make sure no one gets an easier time than they do. What happened to flying being fun?

Where have we come?

Posted By Albert on August 4, 2008, 12:34 PM

Ugh, I so hate it when I sit next to an overweight person who says it's great to have me for a seatmate because I am thin, and he or she can share my space. When you are paying more than $1,000 for an overseas flight and the seat is barely a square foot big, there's no extra space to share, no matter how small you are! Even more annoying are the little kids who are screaming, kicking the seat in front of them and running around throughout the flight. Their parents also expect special treatment. As I said, the trip is not easy for anyone. If you want your kid to be the center of attention, stay home and baby him or her in the privacy of your own home. Trust me, the rest of the passengers don't find him or her nearly as adorable as you do!

Posted By Joanne on August 4, 2008, 12:36 PM

I have spent the last 10 July 4 Holidays in Virgina With family, and The cross country flights have always been harder when I was in a center seat with a Summo -size person each side. I learned early to request An aisle seat and not be too critical of my fellow passengers. I am a thin 125 lb, 5' 8" so I do not need ant accomodation, but large people have a problem with just about everything they do from just staying alive to being too large for a seatdesignerd so it makes ecoonomic sense for the airlines. When I have a seatmate that is plus size I try and not make a big deal of it, and have met some very nice people. They are aware of their size and have enough problems living with it, without some skinning guy rubbing thei node in it!Making them buy an enlrged seat is almost crel and unusual punishment, I wo not want to be reminded of the problem,. Show some compassion, it doesn't cost anything and I am sure the golden rule of "do under others as you would have them do to you" would not be to hard to follow.

Posted By Tom Beezy on August 4, 2008, 1:02 PM

I think that there is a simple solution: standardize "normal" coach and "wide" coach seat widths. Put a "normal" coach tester by the check-in counter. Make it a solid chair where the sides come up, somewhat like a child's booster seat. If someone can not sit all the way down into the seat because they are too wide, require them to pay a 50% mark-up to sit in a "wide" seat. If there are left-over wide seats, offer them to other passengers at the check-in gate. They have this sort of option for carry-on luggage to ensure it will fit in the overhead bin; why not do the same to ensure one's body will fit in their seat?

Posted By Abi D on August 4, 2008, 1:26 PM

I am 5'4" tall and have weighted anywhere from 127lbs to 264lbs. Obese, by definition, is anyone weighting more than 30% over their ideal weight. Can you always tell by looking at someone that they are 30% higher than their ideal weight? If not, you cannot charge more since it will be just a judgement call by the person making the decision. I am currently 34% over my idea wieght but you wouldn't be able to guess it by looking at me.
Once you can accurately determine and prove that a person is obese, then you can think about charging more.

Posted By Liz M. on August 4, 2008, 3:05 PM

If the airlines had not made the seats so small and close together, there would not be a problem. All of us have to cope with higher gas prices, and thats what we do - Cope.
Quite wining.
Airlines cancel or delay flights unless they are totally full, with no extra stews to handle all those bodies. Riding a Greyhound has more class.
The airlines charge extra for everything which keeps us from price shoping best airfares. Get rid of the unions, and lavish retirement plans including health care for life, then you can afford the fuel. Vote for drilling in the USA, there are a lot of things you can do besides screwing the passengers..............

Posted By gene on August 4, 2008, 3:47 PM

I posted on this thread already but am on here again because of Taco Bell being put down! My wife and I are elderly and during these hard times have eaten out at Taco Bell even more than usual, yet we have held our own when it comes to weight. At any fast food restaurant one has the choice of what to order, and how much. At Taco Bell the food is healthier than at other fast-food places, plus one can specify what's not to be put in the food, i.e, sour cream, etc.
So maybe the obese woman at Taco Bell was there as part of her diet!
People do have control over weight if they want to exercise it.
Ray Mac

Posted By Ray on August 4, 2008, 5:34 PM

I'm overweight, but I can still fit in my seat (and not in *your* seat) and use the regular seat belt. I make a point of reserving aisle seats so I can use the aisle-side armrest, leaving the shared armrest to the person sitting next to me. I don't stink, and unless I've had to make a last-minute dash for the gate, I'm not all sweaty, either.

And yet.....the sheer meanness of many comments here against the overweight and obese is really stunning to read. It's odd to have confirmed that many of you really do think of people like me with such contempt. And you don't even know me.

Posted By Marmorgan on August 4, 2008, 8:50 PM

airlines should weigh both bag @passneger to get a fair price for seating. make the over weight pay for another seat for the extra weight. 240 lb.per seat would be a big fuel saving.

Posted By stan on August 4, 2008, 10:32 PM

This is a thorny issue for sure. I think I must
have sat next to Duane on a flight as my neighbor
was a huge man, but he was so sensitive - I really
felt sorry for him. We made it through the flight
together with cooperation, his politeness and my
compassion, but I am sure that my experience was an
anomoly. It strikes me that whenever one group abdicates responsibility for something (another example being parents who have children they neither want nor can take care of)somehow the schools/teachers are supposed to make up for the lapses of good parenting.

Currently we are in an "obesity" epidemic as well
as a fuel crisis. It's not up to the airlines to solve either of these problems; their mandate is to
get us safely to our destinations as comfortably and efficiently as possible and 99% of us do not care to pay extra for anything. I'm amazed at all the people who bought extra seats and did not have same honored by the airlines, that is where I would push back for refunds or satisfaction. We all have to take a hard look at ourselves around the weight issue as well as energy crisis...seems like they are inextricably linked and if we got off our asses and moved our bodies, stopped exercising the arm w/fork to mouth we might win on both counts!

Posted By ra martin on August 5, 2008, 9:03 AM

Lets remember that the airlines are the ones complaining about the fuel costs, and upping our ticket prices because of it. I also think it is fair to have a passenger AND baggage price. If I weigh 120lbs why can't I take 100lbs of luggage? It cost the airlines the same as a person that weighs 220lbs without luggage. There is no discriminating here. They should set a total weight limit (passenger & Bags)and anything above that would be charge accordingly.

Posted By Debbie on August 5, 2008, 9:21 AM

Absolutely, overweight and obese people should pay extra to fly. There are very few people who medically cannot maintain a healthy weight. It is our sendentary lifestyles and poor eating habits that have created this problem. As a slim person, I am also tired of sharing the seat I have paid for with someone overflowing theirs.

Posted By Beth on August 5, 2008, 9:34 AM

Obese persons who encroach on the people next to them should have to pay more and get two seats. The people next to him(her) shouldn't have to endure the discomfort because of the size of the other person. However, that extra seat should never be resold, since it is already occupied. Heavy, tall persons should not be penalized if they don't extend into the seats to the side. Tall people have the added discomfort of having their knees up against the seat in front - sometimes for many hours. I have heard that some airlines provide seats with extra leg room(like bulkheads and exit row seats) for an additional charge - maybe they could do that for extra width for the obese passenger. My husband is very tall and would gladly pay extra for some leg room.

Posted By Curley on August 5, 2008, 9:48 AM

They can start charging plump people for the "inconvenience" when they start charging parents extra fess for the inconvenience of their little darlings howling and screaming and making a nuisance of themselves out of boredom because their parents do not know how to prepare for a flight. I am not a tiny person. But, I do fit in a seat. I paid for a first class flight, only to be greeted by a family with children. If I have to deal with them when i am paying a premium for comfort. So must small people deal with their larger counterparts. If they don't like it, THEY can take first class for more room.

Posted By g on August 5, 2008, 10:19 PM

Yes! I believe if I have to pay $7 for a pillow, blanket, or some other crazy fee to just exist, someone taking up half my seat and keeping me from the restroom should have to pay more. Choices, choices, choices.

Posted By Sharon on August 5, 2008, 10:32 PM

We have to stop making this debate about character of the obese person and more about where the fault really lies, the airlines. The seats are too small for normal sized persons, with normal BMI's so no wonder an obese person is spilling into your seat, hell, a normal size person is spilling into your seat. I have tried to buy two seats only to be told after it was purchased that I had to give it up for a standby passenger then fight to get a refund from United. I am traveling to Europe and I am flying a business class airline so I will not have this issue. I paid more for my seat. However, why is it that normal weighted people are given a comfortable seat when obese people are left to inconvience others and be uncomfortable? Why do we permit ourselves to be ridiculed and have our intellect, our cleanliness, our will power and every other BS stereotype laid at our feet when we try to board an airplane? Stop judging and start demanding that the airlines make bigger seats available to bigger people at the same cost. Why the same cost? Well, you know if you give them an inch they will take a mile. Pretty soon, all you so called "normal weight" people will have to prove you are normal weight to prevent being charged extra. Who will determine who is "normal weight." More than likely it will be the people who make money off the fat ones.

Posted By Jacquie on August 7, 2008, 2:54 PM

The idea of charging more for 'overweight' people to fly than others is ridiculous. According to that logic - men should pay more than women - tall people should pay more than short - Europeans and Americans should pay more than Japanese - etc. etc. - because all of those qroups weigh more on average than the other. Perhaps there should be a sliding scale that would determine your ticket price after you had weighed in - and the weight of your luggage should also be figured into the ticket cost. Without such a system the cost of flights - as it relates to weight of luggage and passengers - for the airlines - will be figured the way they always have - averaged. Airlines are becoming like the banks - tacking on extra costs for everything. Why don't they measure your lung capacity and charge the big inhalers more for oxygen - or charge more according to how much you go to the toilet or how much toilet tissue you use. Enough nonsense.

Vinod

Posted By Vinod Kumar on August 7, 2008, 3:16 PM

If I'm 100 lbs overweight and traveling with my 40 lb child doesn't it even out? I think it would be hard to enforce a weight restriction. After all, shouldn't I then be charged less for my child?

Posted By annette on August 8, 2008, 10:39 AM

The last two times a lost half my seat was on both the outbound and inbound flights of the same trip.
On the first, a huge young man slept most of the way and I spent the trip with with my shoulder/arm neatly tucked into his ample armpit!!!! The second time I boarded the plane (an exit row seat) I noted a similarly large man taking up half my seat. I stopped right there and did not move (holding up the boarding process)until the flight attendants found me another seat. The minuscule "refund" offerred by that airline was not enough for me to ever consider flying with them again. Oh, children? I would not change a thing about their passage. . .only change and charge for inattentive/ineffective parenting (eustacian tubes not withstanding).

Posted By Marilyn on August 8, 2008, 11:26 AM

If I have to pay for my extra luggage, the obese should have to pay for theirs also.

Posted By Marvin on August 8, 2008, 12:36 PM

I can't help but think that a lot of the sniping here ultimately has to do with the fact that flying economy class is already so unpleasant and riddled with extra fees and that people resent anyone or anything that makes a bad situation worse.

I have a trip to Germany coming up, and while my economy-class seat getting there will be a tolerable 18.5" wide (I looked it up), the seat coming back will be only 17 inches wide -- 17! Who would *not* feel pretty squeezed on a nine-hour transatlantic flight in a 17-inch seat?!?

Posted By San Jose, CA on August 8, 2008, 1:08 PM

I cannot believe how whiny people in this country are. While it is true airline seats are small, many of you are talking about 2 or 3 hour flights. There is not enough leg room, the person next to me is too big, my armrest was up, and on and on. For god's sake people, get a grip. Imagine people in third world countries without any food to eat or in fear of losing their lives 24 hours a day reading this and WISHING they could sit on a plane next to anybody. Next time you fly, think of how lucky you are no matter what the seating arrangements are. And stop whining and count your blessings.

Posted By Kathy on August 8, 2008, 1:25 PM

The whole idea of charging passengers per body weight will likely never work for many reasons. However, if airlines can charge more for extra legroom (economy plus, etc), why can't they offer wider seats for an additional fee? I am a small person, and I don't know how many times I have had my armrests taken, and had my legs squeezed on either side because I was sandwiched in between very big people. That just isn't right - I paid for my measly 18" of space just like they did, so I want my 18" fair and square. Start putting wider seats in the airplanes, and charging more for them. Smaller people will probably pay for them, too, just to have the extra breathing space.

Posted By Kelly on August 9, 2008, 10:10 AM

I understand the plight of the obese, however the airlines should have the right to charge them for 2 seats if required. The additional weight does amount to increased fuel costs as well. If you are the size of two normal people, then I see no problem with the industry charging you for two people. As far as the airlines are concerned, if they charge you for 2, then they should be accomodating two (2 seats, 2 snacks if they are not taken away yet).

Posted By Mike on August 11, 2008, 2:48 PM

The airlines have created this problem with their ever smaller seats and now they have many of you people blaming the larger passengers. So many of these comments are so judgemental. How can you people talk this way about your fellow human beings? You know nothing about their particular situations. I am slim but my husband is big so, thankfully, when we travel we can "share" two seats. Also, haven't we all been reading about the fact that America as a whole has a weight problem?

Posted By Meg on August 11, 2008, 8:07 PM

I am a veteran, 28 year, flight attendant and see this problem daily. While our society is becoming more obese, the airlines are kept to certain limits by discrimination against said people. It's a no win situation and will only change if passengers continue to complain. Yes, it is a safety issue when an obese, or severly overweight person, sits at a window exit seemingly blocking that exit should an emergency arise, nevermind that they wouldn't fit through it in the first place! Also at the height of concern, is the fact they cannot roam about, on longer flights, to prevent any health complications in the first place (DVT comes to mind). What would happen if a flight attendant should need to administer CPR or use the AED onboard?? All of these concerns are viable yet today, the airline cannot be forced to charge an obese person for an additional asseat because of discrimination...take it up with your congressman and demand that your safety be taken into consideration and point out that your comfort is also at stake!!

Posted By Rachel on August 12, 2008, 10:41 AM

I'm also a flight attendant, and was thinking the same thing about the discrimination thing. Someone mentioned obese folks sitting in the exit row as a safety problem. The FAA says that if they need MORE than 2 belt extentions, then they cannot sit there. I've never actually seen someone need more than one, so I can't even fathom someone needing 3. And therefore, if a flight attendant moves them out of the exit row (even if they are huge, but have less than 3 extentions), we are being discriminitory. We can't move 85 year old grandmas outta the exit row either if they claim they can perform the functions required (even though, clearly, some would not be able to open and toss out a big awkward 45 pound door. I mean, most the female flight attendants in my yearly training class struggle with opening and lifting that over-wing door). Again because it's descrimination. The whole getting sued for intentional or unintentional discrimination is something that causes the difficulty in creating requirements about obese passengers.

You guys have interesting ideas about this topic. I agree though that if bigger seats were installed, everybody's tickets would be upped. Most of the reason for the price of a first class seat is actually the space. Free booze and gate-gormet food doesn't really cost that much to the airline. getting 1 fare instead of 3 is a big difference though.

To all the obese folks who said they don't get up on super long flights....please do. It can cause greater problems to your body sitting for hours on end than just asking the B and C seats to move so you can stand in the aisles for a bit. That would be less inconvenient than the plane havng to make an emergency landing because of a blood clot. I'm not being facetious either, not moving at all for hours on end is unwise. The other passengers can deal with getting up once or twice.

Lastly, I'm quite small, and everyone in my family is very thin no matter what they eat, and yes it's still not fun to share a seat....it doesn't really mean people need to be so evil in what they are posting here. Some of the verbage on this page is almost painful to read it's so hateful...the topic is about if they should pay, not what an odiously horrible person they are for being overweight. Sheesh....

Posted By Holly on August 13, 2008, 8:34 PM

While recognizing what a painit might be if your space is invaded by an obese person, can you not at least have some compassion for them and what they are suffering? There are a lot of reasons why someone might end up obese -- some emotional, some physical -- and you don't know how they ended up that way so really cannot make the judgment that they are lacking willpower. Obviously they'd rather not be obese. And if you try to deal with them in a more generous, compassionate manner then they will probably do the same. Which of course applies to everything in life ...

Posted By BB on August 14, 2008, 12:45 PM

Wow, this blog was not healthy for me to read. I am fat, at 5'8 and hovering around 300. I have struggled with this all of my life. I lose, I gain. I try, I don't try. The thing is...flying is very uncomfortable for me. I hate the embarrassment of it and avoid things that I love doing as to not inconvenience others around me. I didn't go see my sister in London because I would have had to fly alone. I don't go to plays or concerts at a certain places because the seats are known to be small. I struggle with this daily and try telling myself that people don't pay that much attention to me. I tell myself that this self scrutiny is actually a form of self involvement and to get over it because I'm the only one focused on it. Well, this blog has proved me wrong. I'm sorry I'm fat. I'm sorry if I inconvenience you. I hate being fat, but you know what..I hate rude people too. At least I'm trying to change, but I haven't read one person who is bashing the obese say that they are working on their attitude or rudeness. I would gladly pay extra for more room or for a system that was totally done by weight of all luggage and passenger size.

Posted By Bizzle on August 14, 2008, 9:13 PM

Perhaps there should be an "oversized people section" on planes. A few years ago, on a long and fully booked flight, I had the misfortune of sitting in the aisle seat next to a very fat man. His body and beefy arms spilled over into my space. In order to avoid his body pressing up against mine, I spent the entire trip leaning into the aisle, dodging passing passengers and the sympathetic airline staff.

Posted By Nubia Owens on August 15, 2008, 11:04 AM

I can relate with many of the comments posted. On a recent United flight from DC to Chicago, I had the misfortune of 'sitting' between two obese men. I honestly could not sit down beyond the edge of my seat as each man took over half my seat. The man in front of me then reclined all the way, at which point his head was in my face. When i asked the flight attendant for a different seat, she said there weren't any. I explained my experience to the United customer service rep in Chicago and was told I could upgrade my next leg to first class to avoid a similar experience. This was a ridiculous, insensitive solution on United's part.

Better solutions? Well, make seats larger, for 1. Then, we should all be charged by weight. We pay a basic ticket fee then at the airport we get on the scale with our luggage. If we weigh over a certain amount, we get charged. This way, there isn't any justifiable claim of prejudice against the obese. Also, obese people wouldn't have to pay for a second seat that apparently isn't always left for them to use. They'd fit compfrtably in their seat, as would those who aren't obese. (The extra revenue from the added weight would offset the bigger seat expense.)

I also agree that obese people can change if they want to. I bypass sweets, fats, etc., exercise nearly every day, and watch my portion size. I am not saying its easy, but the rewards of quality health and long life mean more than the temporary high I might get from a slice of cake. The rewards for my discipline should also include a seat I can actually use.

Posted By Chris on August 15, 2008, 1:07 PM

As a flight attendant I see this problem all the time and yes it is not going anywhere and probably getting worse as in general Americans are getting larger every year. Yes there are medical reasons but why is it it used to be very rare to give out a seat belt extension...not so anymore, it is not uncommon now to give out 3-4 on every flt and they have not made them any smaller, people are getting bigger! If airlines have to make seats larger, thus filling them with less passengers, everyone WILL have to pay more as there is a cost per available seat mile per passenger to earn a profit which they are in business for.

If someone for whatever reason requires more of something than someone else, in this case a seat, then bottom line they should have to pay more and come on there are no surprised here. Most people know they can't fit in that seat. I have people every flt that tell me on boarding they need a extension. Tell them when making the reservation that you need more room, pay for it just as the tall man who needs the exit row and pays more at some airlines. With fuel prices like they are airlines can NOT afford to accommodate the obese without passing it on to everyone else. Is that fair? We are a business, not a service and all passengers deserve to be comfortable.

Posted By Thom on August 16, 2008, 11:18 AM

Oh, please..listen to yourselves. Guess what? It has never mattered weightwise or not in all my years flying. There are a lot of disagreeable, nasty people who will don't care whether you're thin or heavy. They want the armrests, they'll take the leg room, overhead space, etc. all of us considerate snooks who followed the rules helped create in our immediate vicinity; then have the gall to roll their eyes, knock you in the upper arms, etc. when you politely ask them to move the newspaper they've unfolded over your own cramped up arm. I've practically had to crawl on top of my husband because of nasty, selfish seatmates such as a number of you people. It's been the same misbehavior whether I've weighed 128 lbs or 200 lbs of getting crowded out by inconsiderate boors, so it's nothing about weight, it's about being a conrol freak! And all of you people who condemn others for weight issues...wow! Way to show your sympathetic and caring personas in this posting.

Posted By CeeGee on August 18, 2008, 12:19 AM

I am 325lbs and understand what y'all are saying about paying extra because I personally do not want to sit next to anyone when I go on a plane for my comfort...not theirs :) Why dont you guys try being overweight and then fly....see how you feel!

Posted By Tracy on November 8, 2008, 4:20 AM

I am a flight attendant and believe I posted on this blog many moons ago. But I see that the posting above mine is fairly recent, so I am going to chime in again.
The point of this blog was not to take people to task for being fat. I think that many, many fat people like to blame their weight on medical conditions beyond their control. It's funny that people in other countries are strangely less affected by these medical conditions. But that is not the point of this blog. It doesn't MATTER why you are fat. It doesn't matter why you are hungry enough to eat two sandwiches at Subway, either, but when you do, you pay for two, whether you are fat or thin, whether you are eating two sandwiches because you like the way they taste or because you haven't eaten a bite of food in days. It's irrelevant. You eat two sandwiches, you pay for two. Southwest has no legal issues charging fat people for two seats. There is nothing illegal about this at all. It is posted on their website and that's that. It's even been tested in court, and Southwest won. If fat people don't like that policy, they can choose not to fly on Southwest. I don't fly for Southwest, but I personally think their policy is more than fair. If you buy two seats and the flight turns out not to be full, they will refund you the price of one seat. I think that's more than they should have to do.
For all of the people who say the airlines should make some bigger seats for fat people: They do. It's called first class. You pay more for a first class seat largely because it is bigger and more comfortable, not because there is a meal or alcohol. Those seats have been there all along. Anyone can buy one, fat or thin. Just because you are fat -- for WHATEVER reason -- doesn't mean that they should be reserved for you alone and doesn't mean that they should be the same price for you as a coach seat would be. You need it, you buy it.
If you think that EVERYONE should pay more for a ticket so that bigger (and therefore fewer) seats should be put on the airplane, well, that is asking me to subsidize your fatness, and I don't want to do that anymore than I am already doing in insurance premiums, taxes, etc., no matter WHY you are fat.
To my fellow flight attendants above who said that they and their airlines would be sued for "discrimination" if and when they move obese people, the elderly, etc., from exit rows, I say, let people sue. They will sue (probably not) and they will lose. Your airline has highly paid people in their legal department to handle this. Your job is safety. Safety trumps all. You are paid for "discriminating" in the sense that you are supposed to discriminate who would be best -- or at least adequate -- in that row. We don't let the blind, disabled, etc., sit there, even when they insist that they can and will open the door. Just because you SAY you can is not good enough, and as flight attendants you should know that. Read your manual and ask about this in training. If you are allowing people to sit in your exit rows who don't SEEM and APPEAR to YOU to be competent, it is not only your right but your responsibility to MOVE them, as nicely as possible. Stop being scared of getting sued. Be scared of trying to evacuate a plane with an 85-year-old or an obese person there. Be scared of THAT. If you are going to sit the elderly and the obese (and God knows who else) there just because they SAY they can handle it, and you are afraid of asserting your responsibility (notice I did not say your authority, I said "responsibility") then I HOPE the feds board your plane and see that, and I HOPE I am never flying on your plane as a crewmember/passenger.
I have had a woman walk down the jetbridge and not FIT through the door of my aircraft. She had to turn around and walk back to the gate. If she had managed to squeeze through, should I have put her in the emergency exit row (since that's the only place she would have fit)? Would you like to be getting your children out of a burning plane with her sitting next to the only available exit? Am I supposed to put her there just because she has the breath to say, "I can handle it"? I DON'T THINK SO, and it doesn't matter WHY she is fat. That doesn't change the situation in an evacuation, does it, that she has some medical condition or terrible emotional history, etc.?
Bottom line: Need two seats, can't sit with the armrest down, BUY TWO SEATS.

Posted By tonivitanza on November 18, 2008, 9:23 AM

It's not discrimination to charge more for something that weighs above the acceptable, average amount. Even when you bring pets, you can only bring pets that fit into the certain storage space under your seat, or off to cargo they go. And in cargo they charge by kennel dimension or by weight, depending on if its national or international flights. I guess they "discriminate" against large or small animals too, right? It would take almost 3x the cost to bring a dog weighing over 70lbs into cargo than it does to bring a dog under 70lbs to Japan, for instance. That's something around $1100US for the larger animal. What say you?

Posted By Jing on November 20, 2008, 2:59 PM

I'm 5'3, 105 pounds, I've always found plane seats to be reasonably comfortable. Of course the airlines are going to try and make them as small as possible...they're a business and flying is trying to be democratized so that people of any income can afford it. But flying is still an expense and in no way, shape, or form should someone else's lifestyle choices cause another person to lose a commodity they have both paid equal amounts for.

If the airlines make the seats bigger, then to maintain their profits, they have to charge more per seat. So obese people- you're paying more anyway. But now YOU'RE not the only one paying more....slim people have to pay more to "distribute the cost" of you being overweight.

When my baggage is overweight, I pay the overweight. I dont wail and complain about how unfair and discriminating and demoralizing it is. But I make healthy lifestyle choices every day to be at an attractive weight, and I honestly believe that obesity is a choice. People can cry about thyroids and genetics as much as they want, but the bottom line is that we have the same genetics that we had a hundred years ago, when almost no one was overweight.

Obesity doesnt exist in ethipia or concentration camps...places where there are no food. Know why? Because your body simply cannot defy biology. It simply cant. If you eat less calories than you burn off, you will lose weight. There is no other excuse...you just will lose weight. It's physically impossible not to. My dad is a physician and he's always rolled his eyes at all the excuses overweights come up with as well.

If you eat less than you burn off, your body has NO CHOICE but to use the weight you already have to keep going...so of course healthy eating and diets work. There's no other excuse.

So yes, the two seats thing is perfectly acceptable...and thin people should be charged less to fly...Im all for that as well.

Posted By Jennifer on November 21, 2008, 1:04 AM

Through no fault of my own, I am 6'4" tall. Do I get extra legroom because of my "disability"? NO.

Posted By calvin on December 1, 2008, 8:07 PM

The Airlines have reduced the size of their seats to the point that all of the general public is at risk. We all know how difficult it is to get into let alone get out of the seats in economy, be you normal or oversized. The risk of Pulmonary embolis due to cramped undersized seating is on the rise, due to the inability to move or get into or out of these seats. You can all moan about personal responsibility, but almost half of all Americans have exceeded the guidelines recommended for weight...We are all cramped into these tiny seats, lets face it, for even a normal sized person, these seats are inadequate. We are put at risk and cannot do much about it. Oh, and hasn't the cost of fuel come down recently and when are those surcharges going to disappear? If the seat sizes were at all reasonable the problem of the oversized passenger sitting in the next seat would not be such a problem.....Just how much has the seat and space assigned to each passenger been reduced in the past twenty five years. I think that it would be interesting to know....

Posted By Andy Pratt on December 10, 2008, 12:22 AM

The problem has an economic solution. Say an airline charges $300 for a seat. The airline wants $900 for the row of three. A certain number of passengers would pay a premium for a slightly larger seat; a certain number of passengers would be willing to sit next to an obese person, if their ticket price is reduced. Either remove the arm rest or disable it. You should be able to match thin with fat, tall with small - and you remove the resentment factor because the parties chose the arrangement. Two obese passengers in a three row seat @$450 =$900; one thin and one obese could be $150 and $450 - the third could be at the $300 rate. On any given trip people pay a wide variety of fares anyway. Airlines could use this as part of a marketing plan; surveys could be used to help determine the appropriate discount/surcharge amounts. Given the choice between two airlines charging the same price, I 'd pick the one that has this policy in effect just to reduce the likelihood of being seated next to an obese passenger and all the physical and social discomfort that would result.

Posted By Bill on December 11, 2008, 5:43 PM

I am 67 years old and even now work very hard at maintaining my weight for my own well being. I do not believe that we should have to give up 1/2 or even a little of our seat because someone is obese. If there is a medical reason and that person has a legitimate Dr.'s note than maybe I will give in a bit. However, we are in small enough seats as it is now,and I do not appreciate having to share what little space I have with someone who is obese for no reason at all. They should pay for an extra seat or get a handle on obesity and lose the weight. I often fly to Finland which is rougly an 8 hour flight. If I had to be squished for 8 hours I would very loudly complain to the airline.

Posted By lynda on December 15, 2008, 6:29 PM

I am an over weight person and have been all my life, I eat less than some of my thin friends. Every day there is a new challenge which is size related. I can't believe the lack of compassion I'm reading in people's comments. I too would like to go on vacation but I would not like to be stuck next to any of you. I'm a person with feelings not just someone who is fat.I don't want to crowd you and I don't want you in my space either. But I'm not blaming the obese person because 80% of our pop is overweight, you would think that the airlines would be more accommodating. Just remember the next time your sitting next to an over weight person say hello and introduce yourself and maybe you'll feel alot more comfortable sitting with a new friend instead of a fat person.

Posted By Mary Jane on January 13, 2009, 2:07 PM

fat people should pay twice as much and pass the savings onto us fit people.

Posted By twitt on January 22, 2009, 10:41 AM

I'm an obese flier who believes in paying for an extra seat if necessary.

However, the rudeness, the sickening stereotypes, and the inconsideration that I am reading on this forum is simply unforgivable. As a person who shares this earth with so many others, I feel it is embarrasing. It saddens me that there are soo many people in this world who are so angry, bitter, and just plain unhappy in their own lives that they feel as though they have to make other's lives a living hell.

If I am paying for two seats, and do not get the extra seat, I deserve a refund.

If I pay for the extra seat and I spill into it, thus using it, then no one should be sat beside me - meaning no one's child, no last minute passengers, no one. Unless I bring along a friend who is smaller than me who doesn't mind me sitting next to them, I want what I pay for.

If I have to pay for two seats, all other passengers should pay for theirs as well. Anyone who can take up a seat should pay for a full seat. The only exception is for kids. Fat or Fit, pay full price.

Folk seem to forget that everyone is a human being. We all think, have feelings, and some of us, although not many, have the capacity to be compassionate. Then again, I keep forgetting we live in an extremely shallow society where if we don't fit into some box, we are not fit to be here, and are deserving of dirty looks, snide comments, and jokes.

God forbid anything should befall anyone who criticizes obese people, or anyone who is different, that will cause them to be the butt of jokes, or subjects of scruitiny and criticizm. Lets see if they are quick to be so judgemental and inconsiderate of others then.

Posted By Shay on January 27, 2009, 10:44 PM

I really appreciate being told I am different. It's hard enough to be this way as it is. Any wonder why some people stop going out of their houses? Try walking in their shoes and living how they are forced to. Yes, we as the heavily obese might cause some problems but don't think it doesn't swing back the other way.
I am one of those obese. I don't like it, I am working on it but for crying out loud it won't come off overnight. Punishing us for being what we are is not the answer. I sit as squished as I can possibly make myself, I try to stay quiet and out of the way. Yes I have to use an extender (even in my car) and I deal. That is what life is all about. Deal with it people. I do, we do, we all deal with something.
At least the airlines have cleared up the biggest question for me: plane, train, or automobile. Nice way to scare off people who might otherwise buy tickets. I know it's bad to be heavy, but what is worse is when you feel like an outsider or unwanted because of others' reactions. We're not on the elementary playground anymore. Let's grow up and try working together. Novel idea. Communicate and try to coexist. It's not that hard.

Posted By Melanie on April 16, 2009, 11:30 AM

I think the Airlines should give a person that is larger 2 seats and not charge then for it if it is necessary. This has come about by the airlines trying to make more money out of each plane they have skrink the seats to the point that they are too small for anyone that is 200+ even my sister that is a size 5 has commented on how the seats have gotten. If the airlines would go back to 2 seats in each alise then this problem would be sovled. I know serveral flight attendence that refuse to work flight that are on a s80 since they have make these planes small. even the aisle is small

Posted By D on April 16, 2009, 5:54 PM

OK - I've read most of these. I am a large woman. I have been flying for the last decade or so for business. When I first started flying, I weighed 50 lbs more than I do now - and the seat belt fit just fine - with room to spare - in any seat. And I could stretch my legs (I'm only 5'5"). Depending on the airline, I have had to use a seat belt extender only once, but it can be pretty tight.

I always try to book an aisle seat, and already some airlines try to charge more for that. I no more want to intrude into your space than I want you (or your kids) in mine. The seat width and the space between seats for your legs has reduced considerably from when I started flying. The last flight I was on, the gentleman in front of me reclined most of the way. I couldn't put down my tray table down because it hit my chest.

I feel the responsibility for this lies with the airlines as they have progressed more and more towards sardine transport. I uaed to fit all seats (when I was larger!) and they have made the travel space smaller and smaller to where I have difficulties though I am 50 lbs lighter. No one wants to be fat. I have always had a lower metabolism. My sisters would feel sorry for me when they were having peanut butter sandwiches as a snack after school when all I had for the day was ice tea - yes, I was down to one meal a day trying to get thin like they were, and the one meal was small.

All of you thin people, please rethink. All fat people do not cram themselves silly with food. Some yes, but others generally eat LESS food than those around them.

This is the last real prejudice that hasn't been deemed politically incorrect. If you narrow-minded skinny people would open your eyes, the world would be a better place. Then we could all pressure the airlines for reasonable seating.

Posted By Linda on April 17, 2009, 5:27 PM

I've read the comments here and I'm sickened by them. I can't believe some of things people are saying. Some of you are talking about obese people as though they are a virus that should be ridden off the face of the planet, my god they are people just like you and have feelings just like everyone else. While I'm sure there are some obese people that don't care about who they are imposing on, the majority of them are trying their best at holding themselves in painful positions the entire trip to cause the least amount of inconvenience for you.

Posted By Luke on April 18, 2009, 9:20 AM

The seats on airlines are already small(I weigh 105 1bs). I think airlines should increase the size of their seats, but I also think weight is an issue that needs to be addressed. Airlines can only increase the size of their seats by so much, you can't have too much weight weighing down the plane. Its obviously a safety issue. We have to pay for the extra weight in cargo we bring on board, perhaps we should have to pay for the extra pounds we bring on ourselves?

Posted By rachael on April 19, 2009, 3:04 PM

I AGREE WITH THE OBESE! I am 3'11 and weigh 78 lbs. I Do not fit into the seats on an airplane. the seats are so narrow my wide womanly hips rub up horribly against the armrests and I NEVER have enough legroom. You need to do something to fix these problems or I will never fly on your airline again! Your hatefull bigotry against the obese will not stand! This is an outrage! The women of NAAFA and their fat admirers will not let this stand. We will march on washington if need be. I can see it now! THE MILLION MOBILITY SCOOTER MARCH. or maybe even the MILLION POUND MARCH. Hell for the latter we would only need 12 of NAAFA's finest heffers and maybe a fat fetishist too just to balance things out

Posted By tara on April 20, 2009, 7:24 PM

I fly frequently, and I am small enough to "share" part of my seat with an obese neighbor. Although I have been in that situation many times, I have never complained because I would be mortified to call attention to the situation. I recognize that it must be embarrassing for those who cannot fit into one seat. At the same time, it is simply unfair for one person to lay claim to another person's space if they did not pay for it. If I had an extra-large laptop, I wouldn't dream of co-opting my neighbor's tray table because I didn't have enough space. If I was traveling with an extra bag that didn't fit in the overhead space, I wouldn't take up my neighbor's foot room with it. Why should it be any different with seat space? You should get what you've paid for, no more and no less, regardless of how small or large you are, or for what reason you seek to take over another person's space. In the long term, airlines should install more accommodating seats, but that's not going to happen in today's economic climate. Airlines must make some sort of accommodation to protect everyone's comfort and dignity.

Posted By Tammy on April 21, 2009, 9:28 AM

to the person who submitted this I believe that Southwest's "Passenger of Size" policy as written is the best possible solution for this problem. I have to say i disagree 100% with that my wife and i were travelling from buffalo to arizona for the xmass holidays with my withs family i bought the tickets months ahead to get a good deal or so i thought .We arrived at the airport checked in no problems there went to our gate to wait for our flight after about 30 mins i was called to the desk and told by a southwest flight att that if i wanted to fly today i would have to buy a extra ticket this was not done as a discrete question lots of people heard him so i asked why he said no body would want to sit next to a large person on a long flight this was him being polite as i am a large man who has flown many miles a year on delta continental and other airlines from the uk to the usa beofre i moved her for good i have had to use a extender belt but i have never taken up others space and always travel with my arms rests down To say i was upset was beyond words my wife came over as she had heard my raised voice and asked what was the problem she was told because i was large i would have to buy a extra ticket now here is the rub i would be sitting next to my wife for the whole flight we showed then at the desk when we sat on there sites i dont take up more space but he would not buge so i had to buy a second ticket at the higher holiday price for the round trip .Mp wife loved the extra space she streched out with her legs up and enjoyed the flight me i was happy with my one chair so in my boo south west you suck you did not even reply to my e.mail after i returned from my trip

Posted By william thomson on April 23, 2009, 11:17 PM

I am a large woman and have been all my life. Recently, my husband and I were in Southwest waiting to board. This flight was an open flight (meaning you sit where you want to) and it would be just an hour trip. Anyway, the attendant at the desk came up to me and told me I had yo buy another ticket. I was at first insulted and embarassed and just very thankful nobody had overheard him (or if they did, they didn't comment or show that they had heard...that at least saved me SOME dignity). So I bought the extra seat though I knew we wouldn't need it. When preboarding was called for, they included me. If the airlines require us to buy an extra seat we SHOULD BE PREBOARDED. The caps is correct. If they want to disgrace and embarrass us they owe us this small civility.
I got to my seat next to the window. My husband took the seat next to me. Yeah we look like we're cuddling the whole way over. Oh wow, like I don't want to be close to my husband and he doesn't mind. Needless to say, the plane wasn't even filled all the way so he could move over and spread out.
I understand people wanting to have room. We all want room. How about a charge for using the recliner or a charge for bringing children under a certain age with you? Come on, I don't want to listen to some squalling kid the whole way. They can't help being the way they are, neither can I. The weight won't just *poof* come off like that overnight. A bit of civility, a bit of honor and respect people, we all need to get along or we all just end up suffering. Let's be better than just mediocrity. The airlines need to get a clue. The time for GREED is done. My question is does a woman with an infant need to buy a second seat for the baby? If not then why should we? And as for the weight limit on airlines, there is an inherit percentage beyond what is listed for safety measures. My husband's best friend is an airline pilot and has been flying since before he could drive (mostly Cesnas back then, now graduated to full-on passenger planes). I think he knows what he's talking about.

Posted By Melanie on April 24, 2009, 12:19 PM

I have never had this problem before. But i also think that larger people should buy the seat next to them if they want to take up its space too. I would get pretty irritated if someone was taking up half of the seat I paid for. But also the airlines should make the seats bigger anyway and stop trying to squash everybody together.

Posted By Kristen on May 3, 2009, 11:17 PM

This has happened to me twice first on a 10 hour flight to Ireland on that flight I had to sit with my arms crossed and above my head because the flight was full and the women next to me was well over 350lbs. Part of her right leg and foot ended up on top of my left one. Resulting bruising down my left leg and a nice bruise on my foot which was an exact imprint of the pattern on my sandals, my mother even put her arm rest up so I could move over but the women’s body just moved over too. With my arms crossed there was no eating or drinking, it was torture, unfortunately the flight was full and no one wanted to change seats with me, gee wonder why. I was sore for days afterward.
The second was just this past Sunday. When I got on the plane a commuter jet from Raleigh to Indianapolis I found over 40% of my seat was already occupied by the girl next to me. She had her bent down reading a magazine and wouldn't look up, never acknowledge or moved when I said excuse me to try and actually get in my seat. I ended up having to maneuver under her arm to try and sit down, but I could sit all the way back because part of her upper body was laying again the back of my seat and head rest. Then she apparently decided that she needed more light to read her magazine putting her upper arm against my shoulder and her elbow against my chest. I had to pull the left side of my body up in what must have looked like a yoga position to left people get down the aisle. She then decides she is done with the magazine but can’t get into purse so she widens her legs more pushing farther into my seat. Attempting to the magazine in her bag got me several jabs in the chest. She then decides to get out her IPod, apparently needing to zone out not only did that require the music to be all the way up but she felt the need to rock back and forth in her seat. Taking the left side of my upper body with her, I finally managed to pull my body out from under hers and sit diagonally into the aisle way. I sat that way contorted with my right leg under my left arm rest during take off. Drink service was fun too. I got to be a human pretzel again to allow the cart through oh joy. The only time my obese neighbor said anything to anyone was to ensure she got her Pepsi and cookies. Since I turned my cookies down she asked if she could have mine too, sure why not I said. Putting the tray table down was fun too. She kept jerking at the table down trying to wedge it between her fat rolls to make it someone flat. That earned me several more elbow jabs to the chest and shoulder. The guy in front of us actually stood up and glared at her because of how much she jerked his seat back and forth trying to get the table down. If he didn’t get whiplash it will be a surprise. Once she had her Pepsi and both packets of cookies (because she really needed them) ear plugs went back in and her enthusiastic rocking resumed. The woman behind her tried to time getting into her purse but timed wrong to sound thud/thwack sounds later confirmed my neighbor had sufficiently knocked the heck out poor older woman. During this ordeal the flight attendant asked if I was ok several times noticing how uncomfortable I was. The first two times I said no/no I’m fine what was I supposed to say no you see the humongous person who is supposed to be sitting next me well she isn’t she is sitting on me can you please tell her to get off. The plane was full of adults there was no where else to move.
Finally after beverage service the flight attendant came back and moved my right arm rest so it was parallel with my seat back which enabled me to sit half on half off the seat and use the arm rest for back support. My upper body still had to be at angle though because as I moved over my neighbor spilled into my seat more. The landing ended up like take off with me contorted diagonally. It’s been two days since the flight. I feel like I was in a car accident and I have bruises from being repeatedly elbowed on my chest.
Should the women in these instances had to have paid for a second seat, YES, because they used two. Do I resent being subjected to both of these women YES. What happened both times, not only made me uncomfortable during the flight but for days after. No to mention they represent a safety hazard to me, because of my inability to properly use my seat. A seat that I paid to have full use of during the flight not partial use, maybe we should have a choice to sit by the obese and only pay for the portion of the seat we actually use. If you can not fit in a single seat you be should given two choices pay for a second seat or don’t get on the plane.

Posted By Elizabeth on June 2, 2009, 2:08 PM

I will sit next to TWO overweight passengers before someone with toddlers. Parents with children are the worst and they don't care if their kids run wild in the aisles or annoy other passengers. Airline tickets cost a fortune. An overweight passenger might inpinge on my space, but passengers with toddlers impinge on my privacy. Leave the little brats at home and bring your overweight relatives. I like them better.

Posted By Annie Mack on June 22, 2009, 11:48 AM

I find most of the comments left apalling. Im only 37 and can remember when airplane seats were twice the size they are now. 2 seats on each side. or 2 on one side and 3 on the other. Leaving enough space to have larger seats.

Even a thin person is not comfortable in the airline seats these days so get over yourselves. You could be thin with broad shoulders and be spilling into the persons next to you space.

I dont think they should just make some seats bigger. They should make all of them bigger.

I cant believe some of the comments some of the people have made on here. You think because your thin that your better then someone heavy. You think you deserve special treatment. How about if you dont want someone spilling into your seat you fork out the money for first class. Problem solved!!!

No one has even commented on all the stories of people who did purchase 2 seats and to only have the seat taken from them and not be refunded. So once the since.

And what about safety? The way the seats are designed sitting on two seats is not safe, and is even more uncomfortable.

The problem is the Airlines being greedy. There should only be 2 seats. Even with 3 thin people the middle person is going to be uncomfortable.

I can not believe how cruel people can be to heavy people. And you think its alright. Well maybe fat people dont want to sit next to ugly closed minded people. Can we get a refund for sitting next to a JACKA**!!!

Posted By Tiffany on May 30, 2010, 1:43 PM

As an obese person, I would LOVE it if an airline offered wider seating at a premium price, but below first class. I would buy it everytime. I agree that an airline that provided 2 rows of "comfort seating", on every flight, and advertised it as the "comfortable airline", people would flock to it. The rows would have to be restricted to larger people, though, and subject to measurement at time of check in, otherwise all the skinny people would buy the seats, too. But our slender bretheren could upgrade to the comfort seats right before boarding if they aren't all occupied, just like a stand-by procedure.

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I first want to state that I'm not a fatty hater. If they don't want to stop eating and stay fat, then go for it.
That being said, I absolutely agree that they need to purchase a second seat or a first class seat if they cannot fit into a single economy seat. I've sat next to large people on several occasions and it was so miserable.
Let me relate it to an analogy. Let's say you bought a house with a yard. Your neighbor has 10 children, and needs to build a guest house in "his yard." But because he cannot fit the guest house in his own yard, he invades your yard. All this because he "needs" something he cannot afford. So instead of living within his means, he's going to get his needs fulfilled at your expense. Think about it. Does this make sense at ALL???????? Do you think that these obese people who encroach on other people's space on airplanes would allow their neighbors to build on their property? Hell no. Those who insist on inconveniencing others so that they can save money are just narcissistic bastards.

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